--------- Tonald Drump said... Oh my I got to open this Playoff Innings ..... CCI vs Jolly Rovers - CCI scored 160 in 40 overs and that is all I know. --------
I know more! I know more! Mostly because I umpired it :-)
In one of the biggest upsets IMHO, #12 CCI beat a very good #5 Jolly Rovers team today despite playing with only 10 men!
CCI arrived with only 10 - theyve apparently had 5 graduations, and 3 people were away this weekend etc. They opened steadily (with Manu and the 16-year-old Hassan), got a few bonus wides, and progressed to 33/0 in about 6 overs as a result. They then consolidated, got to 50/0 in about 13 overs before losing their first wicket, and slowly progressed on to about 100 or so in 30 overs with wickets in hand. Imran then hit 2 sixes in one over (14 off the over), then repeated the doze a couple overs later, hitting another 2 sixes in that over (16 off that over). He ended up getting 43 IIRC. Boosted by the opening partnership, some solid stuff in the middle, and the smacking by Imran at the end, CCI ended up with 160 in their 40 overs. It was a score that both sides seemed reasonably satisfied with - I had umpired Jolly Rovers last weekend when they chased down 190-odd quite easily in Madison, they have a long and good batting lineup usually (including two of the best bats in the league in Ram and Younus), and they must surely have been very confident.
CCI came out bowling very well, though, and JR lost both openers by the 3rd over - after 5 overs they were 6/2. From that situation nobody can play freely, you have to rebuild - and JR's two best bats, Younas and Ram did just that. Ram was eventually beaten by an incutter that clipped his pads on the way to the stumps - it was 45 or so for 3. Then, 2 overs before break, Younas was bowled too going for a big shot after playing an excellent innings (60+ for 4). Another wicket fell next over (19th)... and the first ball of the 20th saw Imran get another, at which point break was taken at 74/6! Jolly Rovers came back from break, and the new batsman was clean bowled second ball... and next ball Ravi tried a big shot and holed out. The 20th over ended with the score 75/8! A very good Jolly Rovers batting lineup had lost 3 wickets in 1 over, and 5 wickets in 3 overs... 5 batsmen in total got ducks for them, an astonishing number given their batting ability.
Jolly Rovers didnt fold, however - the #9 and #10 put their heads down and batted on quietly and steadily, adding 30 or so runs over the next 10 overs, leaving 56 to get in the last 10. They got to about 50 in 9 overs, before the #10 was stumped. The last man came in and batted on steadily too however... and eventually Jolly Rovers needed only about 30-odd more in 4+ overs when the last wicket finally fell stumped as well. In the end the middle-order collapse proved too much to overcome, despite a brave effort from the tail.
Overall a very good, intensely fought playoff game - and a big upset in the end. CCI has been in our league for 4 years now I think, and this must surely be their single best victory since joining our league - they beat a very good team, in a playoff, and to do it with 10 men was a remarkable achievement indeed. Having umpired Jolly Rovers for the first time this season last weekend, I had thought they looked good enough to be contenders for the whole thing - with Ram, Younus, Chit, Nachiket Sardesai and Ravi Patel, they had 5 former Division One players in their XI, and they were playing very well as a unit. But cricket can be a funny game, and playoff cricket can be even stranger - few things are harder than a target-chase in a playoff game after a couple of early wickets have gone down, and that was proved to the hilt today.
Three more playoff games, including some wonderful matchups, tomorrow. After what sound like pretty ridiculous shenanigans that reduced cricket to a farce at Heritage today, its nice that we have at least those well-fought playoff games to look forward to for this weekend :-)
Wildcats Vs Phoenix Wildcats won the toss and elected to bat first in the final game of the regular season...I am wondering as to how quickly the season has come to an end.
WC started their innings nicely with Romeen and Sanjay taking time to settle themselves, and Romeen in particular was looking dangerous hitting a couple of big sixes. Priyank was bowling really well at that time troubling Romeen and Sanjay consistently but he was not lucky enough to grab a wicket. Mithul brought himself on but they could not squeeze a wicket, and the introduction of Nikunj made the difference(He was bowling very well) as he got sanjay to slash at a wide ball and got him caught by the keeper. Sumeet came in 1st down played a couple of good shots and got out trying to clear the offside, then ajit came in next and he was playing well along with Romeen where both Nikunj and Fabian were bowling pretty good, ajit got out trying to clear a long hop from Nikunj and was caught by diwakar, all of a sudden we lost a good position to be in a bad situation loosing a couple of wickets regularly including Romeen,SP and we dragged ourselves to a good enough score of 185 with a very good and patient knock from Vikram who was guiding the tail to reach 185. Sameer was a sporting person when he took one catch of Romeen and he claimed it was grounded and i(we) appreciate him for his sporting behaviour.
Phoenix started their chase and they were on the back foot right from the start and the Tormentor in Chief was none other than Satish who was bowling lightning quick while the ball was moving considerably, Fabian had a hard time trying to connect the ball and he got out slashing at a delivery and was caught well in the slips. Diwakar came in next and he got out to a good ball that moved away after pitching and gone in the slips. Mithul the other opener was playing to the situation taking singles and rotating the strike, but he got a bout of cramps and he had to walk away. Aditya and Athreya joined together at this time, and considering them to be 2 very good batsman the game was still very much on. Satish again bowled a peach of a delivery to Aditya and he was caught behind the stumps, on the other end Athreya was playing dangerously taking chances and hitting on the up and he did get a life 4 times thanks twice to me :-). Naveen and Athreya were playing sensibly taking singles and moving the score nicely, all of a sudden athreya hit a ball to midwicket and went for the run while Krishna made a good stop and threw the ball to the keeper and Naveen was well short of his crease. Athreya was the lone hand contributing a well made 60 and he got out trying to clear the field, and the rest of the batting folded up after that.
This was a good game, was fun to be with the Phoenix guys and Aditya might give a better update in terms of other masala stuff or something i missed, onfield of field etc...
Now onto Chicago Giants vs Springfield Update: We won the toss and elected to CHASE.
Sprinfield started decently and was like 20ish for no loss but then Asim got hot and ripped thru the top order with 4 wickets. Moshi took over where Asim left and got 3 wickets. In the end SP was all out for 77.
Giants chased the total down in 16 overs. Thanks to some great power hitting by Yaseen and Omer.
Another Update: Evanston Won vs Lucky XI. Also saw Jags in control of there game vs Madison. Jags scored 245ish .... lets see if somebody here can update us.
Pak Gym played the "cry baby" cheating game and won the game by making a bad ligh excuse...they were 108/8 chasing 190. At 20 overs they were ahead by 6 runs (MUCC - 77 at 20) and were always waiting to get off the field. The umpire was there 12th player, he was biased!!! More coming up along with the pictures of the ground conditions...
It was a BLACK day in the league when PAK GYM & The Umpire Gray Owens teamed to come up with another controversy of the season. The conditions were perfect for a game but the umpire showed signs of being biased right from ball one of the match. Teams like PAK GYM & Gray Owens should be boycotted from the league...all the teams should sign a petition to ban pak gym from playing in Midwest league & also playoffs this season !!! Fair playing teams like MUCC have been suffering at the hands of cheaters & dirty tricks of Pak Gym. Last year was a similar situation when Hasan was 5 feet outside the crease & was not given run out by the pak gym leg umpire. How many teams will suffer b'cos of this....we are here to play cricket not dirty tricks with cheaters. I guess this is the first time MUCC is expessing their agony against such a team & expressing disappointment over the way things have happened.
This league has become a farse! There is no one to oversee any kind of rules. Pak gets to do whatever they want. Why? TA and his team needs to be thrown out at once... count your days current administration. it's the insane running the assylum right now!
I feel bad for MUCC, and on a personal note i dont think it would get so dark in the second innings by 31st over, i mean we played there last week and we pretty much finished the 40 over game with enough light to site the ball, I am not sure if the game started late or something else, but standard cricket conditions the game can be played unless there are some unknown facts..
Light Condition seems to be excellent in the picture. Seems like all teams should bring a Digital Camera & Video Camera to every game they play against Pak Gymkhana. That seems to be the only way teams can show everyone how Pathetic this team really is.
Sad part is that they are pretty talented and do not need this type of cheap tricks. I guess Kuttay ki doom tehri ki tehri rahe gi.
First time blogger on these pages...though long time reader. It was very disappointing, and I couldn't believe the way the Pak team retreated behind the bad-light rule in the 31st over at around 6 pm with just a few dark clouds in horizon. I guess it was in sheer desperation at being in a losing situation, and one wonders to what depths this team can sink to win. At the cost of respect and fairplay ? On second thoughts, actually, we may be beyond the wondering point - given the reputations that they have created for themselves. I for one will never play a part in any game with Pak Gymkhana again...and I think quite a few of my team mates concur.
Well, the umpire also retreated with the Pak Gym team...wonder what interests he had ? He completely violated clause 13.1 by taking the bails off as soon as the batsman asked for light. Mr.Farmaan was asking Raheel in Urdu.."Bol de usko (umpire) ke light karaab hain?" As soon as they appealed for light...bails were taken off. This is Fixing to the core. They could not spot a red cherry in ample light..color blind I guess. Badri I agree with you MUCC will not play PAK in futur...I hope they are banned from Div 1 after everyone signs a petition.fyi...clause 13.1 below
13.1. Umpire shall exercise proper judgment and wait as long as possible to give both teams a fair chance to complete the game.
Well after watching the pictures i just have say that this is not the way i wanted to play cricket, and its really sad that MUCC had to face this when they are playing a good host even going to the extent of rescheduling the game. I guess the league should rent flood lights for the playoff´s since i am sure the light would be much worse in the coming days... and who knows who all will have a problem sighting the ball in such light.. I have to agree with Adnan about the 2 points to be shared, this is not a rained out game so to my knowledge(Which is rather short) it should be a tie and cannot be decided by the 20 over rule, i might be ignorant on that rule in MCC some one can shed more light on this rule... All in all we want to play Hard but at the same time Fair...
Cover_drive : but the Cavet here is if you read them properly it also talks about 13.2.1. which is not clear as to what would happen if both teams play 20 overs, it was either a mistake or they did not think of this situation. I am not sure if 13.2 will take precedence over 13.2.1 or how it works... Someone who knows about these rules might shed some light.
Is this the first time such a situation happend, if it already happend in the league then we might already know what the rule is. Anyone any past memories...
This has happened in the league before in a Final some time ago between a certain rogers park and you guessed it Pak Gymkhana. If you log on to MCC Archives you will see that the Championship is shared by both teams in 1996 because of an incomplete final due to bad light. I don't know if this has ever happened again with a game that is so critical. The pictures milwaukee united posted look pretty good and if the league is not going to do anything about it this means that the management is just giving Pak Gymkhana a clear hand to do whatever they want in this league. Although we are in division 2 we still aspire to come to Divsion 1 sometime this year or next. And if things are run by a single team in Divsion 1 like this where if you don't accomodate them, they will either beat you up or scheme things against you illegally than we are better off quitting this whole thing altogether. This is indeed has been a sad weekend for cricket in this league. First the Rogers Park Run fest against a 7 strong Muslim Gymkhana team that placed them well for playoffs positioning; than a United and Chargers comeback with a fixing of their own, with United routing Chargers on 39 and getting the score in 2.1 Overs to improve thier run rate factoring all things; and finally Pak Gymkhana pulling the oldest trick out of the hat for claiming bad light at 8 down with 80 runs to go with 2 pretty useless wickets remaining. Today I am ashamed to be part of this Cricketing Feternity
WELL IT'S FOR ALL THOSE WHO ARE SAYING AGAINST PAK GYM
WHAT HAPPENED TO ROGERS PARK THEY WON BY 326 RUNS AND GOT MUSLIM GYM OUT AT 54....NO ONE SAYS A WORD
CHARGERS SCORED 40 AND UNITED MADE THOSE RUNS IN 2-1 OVERS....NO ONE SAYS A WORD....
I WONDER WHY U GUYS R AGAINST PAK GYM....
BATSMEN CUD'T LOCATE THE BALL CUZ IT WAS VERY CLOUDY ( u can change the pics contrast n stuff ) N ALSO THE BACKGROUND WAS FULL OF TREES...WHICH WAS WORST IN THAT SITUATION...
MILWAUKEE UNITED TOOK ALOT OF TIME TO FINISH THOSE OVERS...SO IT'S THEIR OWN FAULT...
IT WAS A GENUINE REASON UNLIKE THOSE 2 PRE-PLANNED GAMES...NO BODY BOTHERS TO TALK ABT THOSE GAMES...
THAT'S JUST WEIRD TO ME...LET ME TELL U THAT UMPIRE TOOK WICKETS OFF EXACTLY AT 6:20 PM....
This is Bhavneet from MUCC. Facts: The game was being played in the right spirit till the drinks break of the Pak Gym innings. At 20 overs, they were 83/4 while chasing the target of 190. Then a collapse happened. And as I see it, the moment Irfan Sohail got out ( all their main batsmen back to the pavilion ), Pak Gym had a feeling that they might lose the game. Time:around 5:35pm They slumped to 109/8 in 31.1 overs. Farman and Raheel (who jut came in) were at the crease. Sadiq who was our only fast bowler operating at that time had just finished his 9 overs. I bowled the first bowl of the 32nd over that was down the leg and hit the batsman on his pad. He told the umpire that he could not see the ball. In my previous over ( 30th over) Farman hit a boundary and they got another couple of runs. The Umpire told us that the batsman cannot see the bowl and indicated that the game is over. He then removed the bails and told our captain that he is not coming back to ground to resume the game. In all the matches played here in Miwaukee, games have usually gone past 7 pm. Th Umpire told us that he has called the management and they suggested him to act as per ICC rule. There was no effort to wait for light to get better ( it was not bad at all in th first place ).
TIme: 5:50 pm Game awarded to PAk Gym.
Time 6:40 I was at home.
The game had sunked to a new low.
Todays match was my last match against Pak Gym. I am not playing against them any more. And MUCC feels the same. I am not a professional cricketer. I am here to play fair cricket in the right spirit of the game. Winnig and losing are secondary. I and MUCC have never been involved in any controversies. This is the first time we are expressing our point of view. More importantly I lost respect for some highly talented and senior palyers.
Another game another story: MUCC vs Capitol. Though facing relegtion, the Umpire and the Capitol team along with MUCC team made all the necessary efforts to finish the game despite of numerous rain interruptions. Capitol lost the game and game finished at around 8:30 pm. The only motive there was to play cricket. HATS OFF TO THE CAPITOL TEAM for their spirit of the game.
Last year MCC vs Wildcats. Lincoln was unplayable due to rain. All efforts were made to play. Eventually both the teams drove to WHITEWATER and game was completed by around 8 pm. KUDOS TO THE SPIRIT OF THE GAME.
Thats why I am here. To enjoy the game of cricket.
HonestCricketer: Regarding ball not being visible, last week around the same time WC was playing against MCC at the very same ground, and the climatic conditions were not any different from what they were today i guess, and when a spinner is bowling do you really think it would be dark enough for someone to sight the ball even if the time was 6:30 PM, and for your information i was batting at one end in the 39th over of the game when a medium pacer was bowling and i could sight the ball, and it would have been well past the 6:30 PM mark you are talking about. Regarding Chargers Vs United i was watching the game if not the complete game atleast a part of it and to my eye it did not look like one fixed, we should give credit to the bowlers who bowled their heart out, and to the team as a whole to be in contention.
I am pretty new to the league and to the organization which goes around this league, I might also get a few haters for what i am saying but the bottom line is i want to play fair, and its upto each individual´s logic as to how they want to play.
I would like to take a different perspective on this incident. The Pak Gymkhana batsmen at the crease when this incident happened did something that teams has been doing for years, even in international matches, however unsportsmanlike or unfair it may seem to the others. Who has not seen on TV, the blinking eyes, hollow stares and what-not-gestures of batsmen at the crease trying to covince the umpires that the light is so bad that they can't even see their hands. So specially for a team that knew victory is a must for their passage to the playoffs, that they are ahead at the 20 over stage, that they are in the doldrums having lost 8 wkts and that bad light is the only way they can be saved, I was expecting this to happen. In fact I wonder how many other teams in the league would not have resorted to appealing against bad light in such a situation. However few that would not have, should be appreciated for their attitude towards the game but unfortunately the truth in my opinion is that there are very few around.
Now comes the most disheartening part of the whole incident. The bastmen can appeal as much as they want but it is the umpire who has to call the shots fairly for both the teams. In this incident the umpire involved showed a distasteful partiality by taking off the bails as soon as the batsmen appealed and not waiting for the light to improve nor wanting to come back and resume the game. The fact was the so called detorioration at that point was caused by a passing cloud and things did actually get even better within 10 minutes as the sun came out from behind the clouds. On top of that the umpire showed great attitude by boasting of his USACA certfication credentials and threatning to have MUCC players who were protesting his decision with bans. I would care less for a certification from our wonderful USACA, known as one of the most corrupt cricketing governing bodies in the world who had their funding taken away by ICC.
It was clear that the umpire had ulterior motives in this entire episode and did want a particular team to get away with four points from this match. I am further ashamed that this was a so called neutral umpire from the league. The petition and boycotts that everyone is talking about should be against this UMPIRE first and foremost. Whether the team involved had asked the umpire to take such a decision is a matter of conjecture, but having no evidence or having actually seen that happen, I would blame the entire fiasco on the umpire.
Bad light is a very subjective matter to the two teams on the field and their relative positions of strength in that phase of the game and there have been quite a few controversies in international cricket over the ages. No wonder finally ICC came up with the light meter to atleast standardize some of the decision making.
Whatever the umpire did and the way he did it leaves a very bad taste in the mouth and is not a good sign for the well being of this league that has grown so much in the last few years. There are these few incidents like this and the so called match fixing in the last round, that needs to be seriously addressed by the management and the league as a whole if it wants to portray a fair playing enviroment for everyone that enjoys cricket. Otherwise the day will not be far when we will see the growth of new leagues in the midwest catering to teams and indiviudals that are disgusted with the way things are turning out here.
Let me dis-spell any myths that people may have about United. We will never stoop to the level of putting the integrity of the game in question. We came out Sunday with the intent and understanding of what we needed to do to achieve a task. Our bowlers bowled their hearts out! Mehul in particular looked like a spring chicken and was unplayable. Our newest addition Yousuf was excellent in support and matched shani's intensity. Dhiraj took an amazing catch at mid-on to dismiss rafi, who was looking dangerous. We were absolutely focused and united as to the cause at hand. Sadiq can shed light on this, we played fair and honest cricket. As captain of the team i take great offense at any suggestions that would involve any sort of match fixing! We play hard and fair, and anyone that knows us, knows we would never involve ourselves in those circumstances.
-------- naren said... HonestCricketer: Regarding ball not being visible, last week around the same time WC was playing against MCC at the very same ground, and the climatic conditions were not any different from what they were today i guess, and when a spinner is bowling do you really think it would be dark enough for someone to sight the ball even if the time was 6:30 PM, and for your information i was batting at one end in the 39th over of the game when a medium pacer was bowling and i could sight the ball, and it would have been well past the 6:30 PM mark you are talking about. ---------
Let me preface this by saying I wasnt in Milwaukee today - so I dont know the climatic conditions, or the light conditions *today*.
However, Id like to say Naren is a little wrong above... I was umpiring the game he played last week at Lincoln Park, and when he was batting in the 39th over, it was not 6:30 pm. It was actually a little past 7:00 pm :-)
That was a top-of-the-table contest between Wildcats and Milwaukee CC, and a *terrific* game. The ground conditions were not great, we started an hour late (like after 12 for an 11am start), and played a 40-over game. Milwaukee made 143 IIRC. Wildcats *started* their innings only about 4:00 or so (partly because the umpire had to move his car during lunch-break due to the presence of cops :-) The Wildcats were ahead by 4 runs at 20-over break IIRC... but they lost wickets afterwards, and the game got very tight. Eventually the Wildcats ended up needing 21 in 3 overs with only 2 wickets in hand IIRC, and the clock had ticked to just past 7pm (at the start of the game, the MCC guys had told me light was good until 7, which was why all had agreed to play a 40-over game to begin with). Eventually, at about 7:15 or so IIRC, the match ended with the Wildcats losing by a mere 2 runs (as a result of which they will not end top of the table for the season). To their enormous and everlasting credit, not one single time did a *single* Wildcat batsman even mention to me that the light may have been getting just a little dull by 7:15pm, despite the fact that a bad-light calloff would mean they got 4 points from the game. I remember chatting with Nikhil as we walked off, his valiant unbeaten innings having just fallen short of glory... and I remember saying to him that the game had been everything a top-of-the-table clash should be - tightly fought, good cricket, good spirit, in doubt till the last ball, played in fading light etc, and his response (*after* the game had ended) was that he might have had to mention the light if a paceman was bowling, but with spinners bowling the last 3 overs (even at 7:15pm) the light had been playable so he hadnt needed to appeal. This was last Sunday, exactly a week ago, at the same venue as yesterday as Naren said. Though, once again, I wasnt in Milwaukee yesterday - I have no way of knowing if the weather was cloudier, the conditions darker etc... just to say that Naren's "6:30 pm end of the game last weekend" actually *underrates* the time, it was nearer 7:15 (I know this well, cos I wanted to watch the 7:30ish start of the Cowboys-Giants Sunday Night Game last weekend... and I ended up missing a large chunk of it despite going to a nearby Wisconsin sportsbar :-)
we have played MUCC and they are the best sporting team in MWCC and it is indeed dishearting to hear that they have to go through sort of ordeal Its very sad to hear that good teams always end up last we have to change this trend sooner or later this getting more and more rediculous day by day there are no code of ethics absolutely and due to all these controversies, teams who are playing hard, winning it right getting tarnished for no mistake of their own MWCC cup is what Pak gym is afer why not just buy them cup in the beginning of the season and reward it them so they will save rest of us from stupid stuff like these incidents like these make people question why they are playing cricket in the first place during this long summer season with stupid teams who do not care about rules or ethics dont know how to play fair this very sad episode in the hisotry of MWCC
Ice_cold, I am sorry but that is totally uncalled for. Please do not start another controversy. We are already inundated with a few. Coming to the Pak_gym game...i am going to play the devils advocate. The team is tainted so it is easy to blame them. I totally agree with DIEHARDFAN. Pak_gym in my view did everything that they had to do to win this game. Every team does that. It happened to us too but luckily we had an umpire who knew the rules. It might not be in the right spirit of the game but I think it is right within the rules. It is really for the umpire to decide whether a game can continue or not. If there is a passing cloud he most certainly should wait for it to pass. That is ICC RULES. they check back if there is enough light to continue playing. This Owen Gray i think is the same guy who gave me out Chest-before-wicket once.
---------- Naren said: Regarding Chargers Vs United i was watching the game if not the complete game atleast a part of it and to my eye it did not look like one fixed, we should give credit to the bowlers who bowled their heart out, and to the team as a whole to be in contention. ---------
I actually watched the entire game, since I umpired it :-) The Chargers won the toss and batted (which Faisal seemed quite disappointed about, since he had mentioned to me before going in that they needed to win by 120 runs - he was *really* hoping to win the toss I think). United took the field... and the first 4 or 5 overs that Mehul bowled were probably the best pace bowling Ive seen in any game Ive umpired in the last 2 or 3 years at least. Anyway Mehul is one of the better pacemen in the league - yesterday it was as if he was bowling with this intensely focussed fury :-) The pace was significantly up, and he had the ball on a string, quite literally making it talk. He swung the ball both ways at will - bowled maybe 4 or 5 balls (left arm over) that the batsmen prodded at and missed just about off-stump line, which the keeper actually collected almost in front of first slip - ie the ball didnt just angle away, it actually swung away more than a foot or two by the time it reached the keeper (one of the Chargers mentioned to me after the game that "lambi-lambi swing ho rahi thi" :-) And he swung the ball back into the righty so often and so prodigiously that 3 of his wickets were righthanders who were clean-bowleds, one of them leaving the ball alone outside offstump (and one very very loud shout for LBW was turned down because the umpire thought it was swinging in too much, and might have missed legstump, much to the bowlers chagrin :-). Mehul quite literally looked as if he could get 2 or 3 wickets an over yesterday early on - its one of the rare times figures of 8-0-14-4 actually didnt quite reflect how well the bowler bowled :-)
The Chargers had XI guys, and pretty much their normal full team (though a few were apparently playing while fasting etc). They didnt have anything to play for, and did change their batting order around, but pretty much everyone played (I think they were missing only Hilal, their regular opener and offie, and I think one other player who has gone back to college or something... but most of their normal XI played). However they lost wickets early, and things just seemed to snowball on them from there (they were mentioning afterwards that this has been a big problem for them, they collapsed to 70 in St Louis a couple weeks ago etc). They opened with Reid, who often bats low in the order - he was out in the 3rd or 4th over IIRC, pulling at a short one and top-edging. Then Mehul clean-bowled Sami, the Chargers regular opener (who has opened for about 10 years in our league).. a gorgeous ball, left arm over, swung in late, went between bat-and-pad as he defended forward and took his stumps. In came captain Javed... and his first ball was pitched very full, outside offstump, he left it alone, and it curled back and took his offstump. Rafi was batting at this stage (he scored a century against Flames a couple weeks ago, and has been batting up the order since I believe).. next over from Yousuf he absolutely *smoked* a ball over midwicket, just smashed it.. and Dhiraj leaped up, extended his arms full over his head, and caught it one-handed (and immediately asked for ice to fix the damaged hand :-) Ive umpired Dhiraj only for 2 or 3 years (with IIT and then with United) so I obviously cant be sure, but I'll bet an Usmaniya-biryani that he hasnt caught a better catch in his life :-) Suddenly Chargers were like 4-down for 7 or so as a result!
Then Yousuf bowling at the other end broke the innings back - he bowls excellent leg-cutters often, and the ball yesterday was swinging a *lot* (it was chilly still at 10am, and quite breezy at times). Yousuf legcut it quite a bit yesterday, enough that he occasionally had a wide-outside-off problem with it. Kamran's second ball, I think, he got a legcutter that pitched middle-legish and removed his offstump - he had gotten squared up and a bit tangled trying to defend it, but the ball was quite the jaffa. And very next delivery, his brother Irfan's first ball was in the corridor outside off, he drove, and got a thin edge thru to the keeper - that was the heart of the batting right there. Next over another Mehul inswinger removed middlestump, and suddenly the Chargers were reduced to 22/7 in 10 overs. The Chargers tried to bat on (Mehul and Yusuf bowled 7 overs on the trot apiece, but they had tired and werent quite as effective after their first 5 each IMHO) - Iqbal hung around a long time, the batsmen defended and took singles and took the innings past waterbreak, but could only end with 39 at the end (Mehul finished it getting the last man plumb LBW). United decided at break that they wanted to get the runs as quickly as possible to make absolutely sure on runrate, and came out swinging for the fences with their two 20/20 openers - the first runs were actually a pullattempt on the first ball that went over the keepers head for four - and United cantered home getting the target in the 4th over.
After that it was all down to runrate calculations - they had brought a laptop to the field :-) Final positions were all up in the air, but they seemed to think they were into the playoffs, and maybe ahead of Pak Gym unless Pak won by a big margin in Milwaukee.
Not everyone has inputted all the scorecards yet - do we know final positions on the table already? At least the first 4 seem set, but the bottom 4 we dont really know the order yet, do we?
If the 2nd innings of the match has progressed beyond 30 overs mark .. before play abandons ... why not we take the 30 ver score as benchmark for deciding the game result ??
In fact .. after 20 overs .. the match result should be decided based on every over ...
Sadiq sir .. your thoughts on this ??
Since devising a duckworth-lewis kind of formulae would be extremely difficult .. this could be extremely good method ...
So why not use the duckworth-lewis system ? The tables are available for free and the calculations are not that difficult.
Personally however, I don't think we need to overly complicate things as long as the teams don't misuse the 20 over rule. And I know most of the teams are pretty fair when it comes to completing a game. Everyone of us makes some sacrifice or other to play...i hate to see a day wasted on an incomplete game.
----------- Alpesh said... A thought !! If the 2nd innings of the match has progressed beyond 30 overs mark .. before play abandons ... why not we take the 30 ver score as benchmark for deciding the game result ?? In fact .. after 20 overs .. the match result should be decided based on every over ... Sadiq sir .. your thoughts on this ?? Since devising a duckworth-lewis kind of formulae would be extremely difficult .. this could be extremely good method ... --------
In fact, something very like this was suggested last year at the Umpire Training course, by the guy teaching the course (he is an international umpire, and had also conducted a course and umpired some games in Michigan, before Sridhar got him over here to help train).
His suggestion was... after 20 overs, compare 20 over score. But after, say, 26 overs, compare 25 over scores. If say 32 overs have been bowled, compare 30-over scores. If 36 overs have been bowled, compare 35-over scores. And so on. If its too difficult to compare after every over... then, fairer than 20-over-comparisons at least, would be the "nearest round-number-over-comparisons", ie every 5-overs the comparison changes. And he felt that wouldnt be too hard for even umpires - they could ask score every 5 overs and note down in each innings, not too much more work. (Every over comparison would be too difficult for umpires to keep... and some teams dont have scorers, it it still comparable with our current scoresheets etc, but sometimes some folk dont fill in "end of over total" after every single over while scoring, even though they should).
The above is not the best system either - IMHO anything that totally ignores wickets lost cannot be a really good system - but it is clearly at least an incremental improvement over our current abysmal "lets go back to 20 overs and look" system. I do remember suggesting this idea during the AGM last year, but it didnt seem to have many takers, Iam not sure why.
BTW, does anyone know all the details/results of the playoff games played yesterday? There are no updates on the site, and all we have so far is a Giants report (thanks a ton-ald), a brief mention of Evanston possibly beating Lucky, and no final result of the big Jaguars-Madison game.
Also BTW, Alpesh, please call either Marghoob-bhai or me tonight, or else email or something. I mentioned to him on Friday that you were willing to umpire this weekend... but neither of us still had your number since you moved to Seattle etc :-)
Yesterday's incident led me to delve a little more into the D-L method and contrary to my so-held belief, it was not that complicated, specially since the standard resource conversion tables are all available at ICC and other web sites. The umpires armed with this table and simple instructions on how to calculate the par score can do it easily in my opinion. By the way the par score for Pak Gymkhana when the match ended last evening was 158 (My first attempt at D-L calculations). And they were 110/8 and won :(
Thanks for piquing my interest "Cricket is my life"...I never realized it was so simple and fast to do the D/L calculations !
D/L table is here: http://www.icc-cricket.com/icc/rules/d-l_table.pdf
Match situation: MUCC 190/8 in 45 overs Pak Gym 110/8 in 31.1 overs.
1) Use 95% as total resource % available for 45 over matches (per the D/L table)
2) For overs remaining (calculate using only completed overs) and wickets lost, look up resource % value from D/L table. In this case, Pak Gym had 14 overs remaining and had lost 8 wickets.
3) Value from D/L table is 11.8
4) Subtract: 95 - 11.8 = 83.2 %
5) Calculate 83.2% of 190 (which is MUCC score) to get the par score => 190 * 0.832 = 158.080
6) Round lower and add one run to get the target win score (at the end of 31 overs). 158.080 => 158 => 158 + 1 = 159
You are forgetting the most important part of D/L here: those numbers are based on last few (3 or 5 I forget) year of data from the international matches! It has no relevence in our league - you need someone to calculate a 'par' score for our league by getting into lst few years' data and then crunching those numbers! By the way here is a photo of Milwaukee conditions from our perspective: http://www.flickr.com/photos/31497260@N00/1397932650/
Pictures can be used/edited to prove anything - stop abusing Pak Gym and take up your issue with the umpire, who we don't really know very well, he just umpired in one other match for us vs Bears.
Who want to add confusion to an already confused league? Implement the D/L rules and create a better discipliniary committee,they will be needed then as well.
pics can lie not skies mr raheel go look blue sun shining sky in the pics that mucc posted and your pic. you guys stoop to the level no can in this league We all know what kind of team mucc is and they having come to this blog to post their frustration tells us one and only one thing you guys have brought this beautiful to the lowest ebb in entire league period
Compare the pic Raheel posted to IMG_2321 MUCC posted. When MUCC took the picture there was no Pak Gym Player there. They were all in their cars getting ready to head back. Lets assume that Pak Gym took the picture they posted themselves ( when no MUCC player was there ). In that case they knew excatly what picture MUCC has taken. So they went to same spot from where MUCC took the picture and said " Smile Please".
OR is it pure coincidence that both the pics are the exact same except for ........(please guess the difference yourself).
Am done on this issue now.
Mr Raheel and Company Good luck for the games ahead.
Firstly, my intent in using the MUCC vs Pak Gym game situation was to show how easy it is to use the D/L method and that it can/should be adopted by our league.
Secondly, there are 2 versions of the D/L method - the professional (which requires a software) and the standard (which uses the D/L tables). Per the D/L website: "For innings when the side batting first (Team 1) score at or below the average for top level cricket (which would be about 235 for an uninterrupted 50-over innings), the results of applying the Professional Edition are generally similar to those from the Standard Edition.".
I don't think there will be too many to dispute that if our league played 50 overs a side, the average score would be around or less than 235.
They way you are trying to creep into the playoffs is sad. You just picked one of the pictures from MUCC and enhanced it to proof your point. If things were any different you would have used your own equipment to capture your own pictures. Since things were not in your favor you did what you wanted to do and get away with it. Rumor has it the Owen was paid-off and called TA and TA authorize him with freedom to act in the interest of Pak Gymkhana since PG has been on the management case for handing down the suspensions. So by taking the right decision management will pay through decsions like these in the favor of PG to keep them off their backs. If the MCC MGMNT. let this slide, it will be a clear indication of being on the backfoot with PG. Honest Cricketer / mohd bakshi of pg, what happened to your guarantees of PG beating MUCC you were right by hook or crook you have beaten them and the spirit of cricket also in the process
Looks like the picture taken by us has been modified by Pak Gym guys. The teams who have played against us know that we don't have any interest in modifying the pictures as mentioned in earlier comments by someone. Anyone can make out, I don't know if they have the ability of being invisible because I did not see anyone standing beside me while taking the picture, so Pak Gym guys stop fooling around....
Change your behavior if you expect a team to write a letter of recommendation so that your banned players can play in playoffs...
What's new? Naren, read your summary, and I have nothing to add except that I enjoyed playing the Cats. Very sporting team, who fights hard. And the umpire had a pretty good game as well, I'm not sure that there were any players on either side that were unhappy with his decisions!
Good luck to you guys, and I hope that you make it to the finals. Although I support Cats and Challengers, I'd love to see UCC take home their first Championship. Good luck to all.
Are you guys planning to take this matter any further? I do have a lot of respect for MUCC and the spirit with which you play the game. It seems that the Umpire's actions definitely can be questioned and should be. We've had some particularly poor umpires in the past and I don't see them umpiring any more (thankfully). Maybe this umpire deserves the same scrutiny?
Either way, I'm sorry that you guys had such a bad experience.
There is a reason why Pak Gym is the most hated team in this league. Calling them defending champions is a disgrace to the league. I don’t know what satisfaction there is getting four points like this. The league will do well without teams like Pak Gym playing in it.
Mr. Owen Gray – Please don’t say you are USACA certified anywhere else. It’s funny. Umpire is supposed to run the game in all fairness and make sure the game is completed. Not run away as soon as the batsman says he can’t see a spinner’s ball in very well playable light. There were playable conditions, the light was good even after 45 minutes after we left the field. Next time, atleast don’t be so obvious. Do some acting, learn from Pak.
Pak Gymkhana - Please take Pak out of your team name. You are bringing disrepute to a country by your cheap, dirty tricks. And to think that some of you have taken a break for Namaz (prayers) during the game and still gladly do this…that’s unexplainable!
We really kicked your ass yesterday, didnt we!! atleast we have the satisfaction...
We at MUCC have made a decision to boycott Pak Gymkhana team. We will never play a game with Pak Gymkhana in future. If the game is scheduled then congratulations to Pak! They are already on the points table with 4 points for next year... I hope teams follow suit and boycott them, there is no place for teams like this in this beautiful game.
There have been obvious violations by the umpire and unsportsman like conduct by the Pak Gymkhana team. MUCC lodged a formal complaint to the management (and judicial commt) and we will do whatever it takes to get justice done.
Looks like AAA and Capitol are coming back to Div 2 next year...and the Flames seemed to have just been saved by their marginally higher Nrr over Capitol.
So I guess Satha will be back to his usual self of clobbering around the Div 2 bowlers all over the park(s).
What I dont get is how come the website showed that Pak gymkhana's game with AAA was supposed to be last week and also that AAA had received the walk-over from PG but instead the same game was rescheduled to this past weekend and this time AAA gave the walkover to PG...which just helped PG for their playoff race.
*hit always keeps circling around PG all year and every year. Even them being the defending champions in this league earns them no respect with all the tactics they manage to get involved in every year. Good luck to all the teams that ever face this "above the law" team.
Raheel how did your conscience even agree to what Farmaan was saying "bol de usko (umpire) ke dikh nahi raha hain". btw crappy job in changing the pic MUCC took. Lets count the # of teams that want Pak Gym out of this league.I think if more than 10 teams vote out Pak Gym, then they should be banned.
1.Muslim Gym 2.MUCC 3.United...can anyone confirm from United
Lets add to this list & see if we can throw the dirt out of this league....sorry I mean cheaters out of this league.
I thought it was clear that I had taken the same picture and adjusted the brightness and contrast - just to show that you can't trust pictures. Appealing to an umpire for light is no different than appealing for an lbw or ct behind decision, he can approve or deny and in cricket you have to live with the decision. I'm glad you have the satisfaction Mr. Sadiq, may be now you can shut up because you're totally satisfied.
The issue has been raised with the management and we are waiting to hear back from them.
Interestingly, as another of my team mates pointed out, there is no mention of using the scores at the end of 20 overs to decide the winner of a game in the MCC ground rules !
Adi: Thanks for rubbing in the salt of me not performing upto ur expectations ;-), I can take it anyday given final outcome.. All the best for you guys for the next season and see you around at the playoff's
Farman just appealed to the umpire that he couldn't sight the ball and the umpire agreed the conditions weren't playable - take it up with the umpire and management. If the umpire had said no the conditions are fine, we would've played on. We hardly know the guy, he has just moved here from FL or something and defintely not buddies with us. I'm done talking on this subject, good luck with getting us "banned".
Raheel...this proves that you are buddies with the umpire....none of us knew that he is from FL.Kitne paise diye usko...100,200? Don't worry no one is going to be there to play against you even if you dont get banned...just play book cricket in that case. Do you think you own this league?
Lets get the ball rolling to throw Pak Gym out of this league...the count is 3 for now & sign a petition before the playoffs begin
1.Muslim Gym 2.MUCC 3.United...can anyone confirm from United
Last year, Pak Gym players failed to wake up to go and play the game they love so much. Raheel's defence of the action was enough proof of...you know what.
So is true, your team should now be in the playoffs. Looking at the points table, if you update the last game's score against Muslim Gymkhana...u should go above PG right?
Can you confirm or let us know if there are any hidden decisions that is stopping you guys from being in the playoffs?
Simon D, I firmly believe giving a walkover is a team's right if they choose to do so and shouldn't be anyone else's business. Like AAA gave 2 this weekend! And like Eagles gave us one last season in a night match. That story is old .. move on .. a lot of teams in all divisions give walkovers for whatever reason, its their decision and right to play or not to play.
m, please state which exact rule did we violate or how we "cheated"? If you have proof that we bribed the umpire then bring it forward, otherwise its just speculation and you have no case. If you think the decision was wrong thats between you and the umpire! You probably think that by saying "ban Pak Gym" repeatedly it will come true! I wouldn't hold my breath.
Story may be old, and its your right to give walkover. But your team's character was questioned last year and is being questioned again. That's the point. There's no smoke without fire.
I haven't seen MUCC guys active on the blog so far. But look at this week.
In that case you're way behind the rest simon D, you're still in the questioning phase, people have already passed judgement that we cheat, bribe umpires and what not.
I am in the "I told you so" phase. You just misunderstood. Don't get confused. You need to prepare for you team's goonish behavior in the playoffs. Get on with it.
--------- Cleo said... Asmar, So is true, your team should now be in the playoffs. Looking at the points table, if you update the last game's score against Muslim Gymkhana...u should go above PG right? -------
Actually, its so close that we wont know till the scorecards are uploaded, I think!
Most of us had presumed, even on Saturday, that Pak Gym only needed to win to make it, since their Net Run Rate was above Rogers Parks and Uniteds (and their NRR couldnt drop after winning, it cant). But this one has actually been an exception! Because, of course, they won on 20-over rule, and the NRR is decided on the game played right uptil the interruption (thus for this game Pak Gym got 110 in 30/31 overs, while MUCC got 190 in 45 overs... thus, despite winning, Pak Gyms runrate was lower than their opponents for this one game, and their overall NRR unusually actually *dropped* after this game!)
Pak Gym's NRR was IIRC something like +0.46 or so before this weekend, and now its +0.401 (theyve updated their scorecard).
Rogers Park hasnt updated its scorecard yet, nor has Muslim Gym, so we dont know what exactly their totals were this weekend. Going by the approximate totals mentioned on the blog.. a quick back-of-the-envelope calcuation (using 380 and 55 in 40 overs for the MG/RPCC game) gives about +0.397 for RPCC's NRR.
With *approximate* scores used, the NRR differential is 0.003!! This is a staggeringly small number - and thus until the actual detailed scores are uploaded, we wont know exactly what it all works out to. I mean, I plugged in 380 and 55... what if it was actually 385 and 45 (and not exactly what we heard on the blog? The actual cards need to be examined).
Iam sure Asmar and Rogers Park are furiously checking scorecards right now to make sure everything is accurate (for both them and Pak Gym :-) I mean, just take this latest Pak Gym game vs MUCC... Pak Gym's scorecard says they scored 110/8 in 30 overs, MUCC says it was 109/8 in 31.1 overs. When the NRR differential is 0.003... who knows what even miniscule discrepancies such as 1.1 overs in the scorecards amount to?
I would join Cleo in urging RPCC and MGCC to upload their scorecard from this weekend... we're all dying with curiosity to know what the final figures actually are :-)
Raheel said... Farman just appealed to the umpire that he couldn't sight the ball and the umpire agreed the conditions weren't playable - take it up with the umpire and management. If the umpire had said no the conditions are fine, we would've played on. We hardly know the guy, he has just moved here from FL or something and defintely not buddies with us. I'm done talking on this subject, good luck with getting us "banned".
I won’t insult your intelligence by suggesting that you really believe what you just said. This is the third straight week your team has done something imprudent. But way to go, it sure takes some mettle to backup your teammates.
I know you feel obligated to come on this blog and give us the "Pak Gymkhana perspective", since you’re the only guy in team who can speak more than three words of English. (The rest of the guys are still stuck on "Yes", "No", and "Titties") But buddy, how many strikes do you guys need?
Lets look back at all the events over the past three weeks. 1. You reschedule a washed-out game against Milwaukee United. 2. Your teammates attack and beat the crap out of Muslim Gymkhana players. 3. You call-off a game because of ‘bad-light’ at 5:50 PM
You still expect us to believe anything your team says?
Raheel, you’re a sensible guy (before you get all excited, let me make one thing clear: “sensible” doesn’t necessarily mean “smart”, you can sensible and stupid at the same time.) Your stupidity is renowned, but I was under the impression that you had a little bit of commonsense.
Do you really expect us to believe that a game can actually be called off at 5:50pm in mid-September because of bad-light?
Do you really expect us to believe that the umpire, Gary Owen, is not intimidated by the fact that he has a two-hour trip back to Chicago with the same Junglee’s who started a fight last week?
Raheel, I like you. People say I've got no taste, but I like you…seriously. Just don't let your mind wander - it's far too small to be let out on its own.
cmc, relax dude...what has TA and his team got to do with what happened in Milwaukee over the weekend? Think about this, they got to deal with this kind of shit as well on a voluntary basis.
you are so right about everything but i have a question for MWCC?
when PAK beats the crap out of Muslim why Muslim guy got suspended? for cursing i just dont understand how much more this league going to protect Pak. i think someone said TA should start counting his days. i think its time we need some new People to run this league and see what they have to offer.
ahahah cry me a river, listen honest cricketer, i am sorry lieing cricketer, i mean mohd baksi, u can keep crying and do name calling but guess what u are outta playofff, na na bu boo!!! mommy i didnt make it to playooff cuz other teams are better then ours!!! so beg and plea to tairq but u are not gonan play, sorry i forgot the most important one bribe the umpire!!!! ur a wus ur self!!!!! All the tactics and tantrums ur team has thrown, u are still out and united and rogers park are in go F urself, EVEN TA COULDNT SAVE U THIS TIME ITS A MATTER OF TIME UR TEAM WILL VANISH FROM THIS LEAUGE. REMEBER ONE WORD KARMA!!!
well management should look over our game that we played yesterday...they won't find anything wrong wid that....on the other hand u gays making 379 in 27 overs that's suspicious and also i think that game was played under the right spirit of the game (corret me if i am wrong)...management shud luk into that...
if that's how it's gonna go then we don't mind letting u guys play against muslim gym in night semi final...
I STILL CAN'T STOP LAUGHING THAT ROGERS PARK MADE 379....HAHAHAHA
we would be more then welcome to share our score books to any one the umpire has orignals, we won bottom line and we in playoff!!! So ur predection was wrong so suck on ur thumb and learn to write more words!!!!
Ram, We are playing Purdue in our QFs - a tough matchup. Purdue is a young team, and play extremely smart, so we have to play smart. Its going to be a good game!
Thanks for the wishes! Stop by if you can. You too Preetam... Howz everybody else doing? Didnt feel like bloggin for a few days..
Congrats and good luck to all the teams that made playoffs in both divisions!
We have just couple of more weeks of cricket left, lets make the best outta it...
Guys guys.. lets keep the blog clean. Do not indulge in personal attacks of any kind on the blog.
Also, please do not make us administrators have to police each and every comment that gets added. If this continues, we will have to shut down the option of adding comments, thereby robbing the genuine ones that we can all share. So please, keep it clean and professional.
--------- m said... Probably Pak Gym are not that good in Maths, otherwise they would have done something with NRR. We are done on this topic... --------- Asmar said... Congratulations to United and Rogers Park for sealing the last spots of the Playoffs!! Hopefully there are no further issues!! --------
I know Pak Gym (maybe for good reasons) have become whipping boys on this blog for the past few weeks, and so many detractors are glad to see what they think is "divine justice" and Pak missing the playoffs.
But, at least on the surface... surely there must be *some* questions about the above? I must say, I find myself confused as to how the above NRR's were arrived at.
First, I note, Pak Gym's NRR has dropped further since my last post this evening - the "30 overs" against MUCC was actually 31.2 overs presumably, and so they have dropped to 0.385 NRR. This is probably the most accurate reflection of their true NRR. (A good point was made tonight, however - if a match is being decided based on 20-overs, doesnt it make sense to use only the scores of those first 20-overs for NRR calculation as well? It is surely counterintuitive to have a team win and yet *drop* on NRR so much. But thats a different point entirely).
However, in re Rogers Park's NRR... how come they played only 27 overs in all? Its a 40-over game, isnt it? And they batted first, didnt they? If they were allout in 27 overs... that counts as having played 40 overs for calcuating NRR. Even if someone was retired hurt or something.. its a 40-over game, you cant bat first and "declare" after 27 overs as far as I know, if you bat first you have surely played all 40 overs, havent you? (Iam sure Muslim Gym didnt bat all 40 overs in making 54 allout, but for NRR purposes an allout counts as having batted 40 overs here too).
The updated scorecard (which is giving us Rogers Park NRR as 0.543 currently)... thats been calculated by the formula after 27 overs were input as RPCC's innings in this game. It changes quite a bit if they are listed as having played 40 overs, as they should be, surely?
I understand most PakGym detractors are over the moon at them being edged out on NRR... but lets be fair here. If we ask hard questions to Pak about how they arrived at their NRR's, we have to ask the same hard questions of everyone else in the race too. So I hope Asmar doesnt mind if I ask him about the above - Iam just curious what the explanation is about how the NRR was arrived at, is all.
If the scorecard for PG and RPCC are checked and validated, it seems the 31.1 overs are correct as reported by the bowling team. The total overs bowled by them is 31.1 so PG nrr is correct. For RP if the nrr is calculated based on 40 and not 27, they still edge out PG by some difference. Nice catch c8w, although I don't think much will change for the Playoffs. PG will still be out and RP and United still be in. I for one am ready for Playoff bshing. Hopefully Management can adress this and get going with the planning of the playoffs either ways. I think one of the better games for the plyoffs will be Challengers and Purdue. I think Purdue will edge out Challengers, St. Louis will take care of business against RP, United will win over Milwaukee and Muslim will win over the Wildcats. Let the Games begin.
Does anyone know what happened yesterday's night fixture? Adnan, Faisal, anyone from AAA
No rules in ICC or MCC for declaring an innings batting first and what happens with the nrr calculation. Also no rule in MCC for counting nrr ofr 20 overs when 31.1 are bowled. If these issues are raised they will should be addressed for all teams in all games wither rained out or appropriated by the 20 over rule.
Something terribly wrong with this league...now with all the insults...why is TA not chucking in. There has to be a reason...they gain we fell the pain,and we come here and fight like little girls.
--------- Tango said... Lets look back at all the events over the past three weeks. 1. You reschedule a washed-out game against Milwaukee United. 2. Your teammates attack and beat the crap out of Muslim Gymkhana players. 3. You call-off a game because of ‘bad-light’ at 5:50 PM
You still expect us to believe anything your team says? Do you really expect us to believe that a game can actually be called off at 5:50pm in mid-September because of bad-light? Do you really expect us to believe that the umpire, Gary Owen, is not intimidated by the fact that he has a two-hour trip back to Chicago with the same Junglee’s who started a fight last week? ------------
Nice to have you back, Tango. And I hope I never get on your bad side, it would be bloody scary with your ability to evicerate people with the pen :-) (jab baccha raat ko rota hai, to maa kehti hai so ja, so ja, nahin to tango aa jayega :-)
Still, I shall be brave enough to play devil's advocate to you above :-)
First, BTW, its Owen Gray who is the umpire I think. He is a USACA qualified umpire from Florida who came here a few weeks ago, he umpires on a regular basis at a pretty high level in Florida supposedly - he has umpired the past few weeks for us in our league.
Second, Owen Gray travels to games on his own, and travels back on his own. Thus, he would have no fear of any "I have to travel back with these guys" theory that you suggested. (As an umpire myself, BTW, I have travelled innumerable times with both Div1 and Div2 teams that ended up losing away games, and I travelled back with them. Ive never made a decision on the field based on fear of what the travel back would be like myself, at any rate :-) Most people in the league are pretty good guys really - despite losses Ive never had any unpleasant drives back with anyone, I dont think (well, maybe one time, out of dozens of such games... but that team isnt in the league anymore anyway).Heck, with the Eagles alone - I think Ive travelled with them when they lost away games by 1 wicket and by 2 runs in the past... and we still stopped for dinner on the way back, and had pretty pleasant times overall.
I umpired with Owen on Saturday - we did the CCI/Jolly Rovers playoff game together. He's a pretty decent guy, and did a fine job umpiring that game at least. He has, IIRC, only umpired one Pak Gym game before this weekend - he doesnt really know them much (and, in fact, to be honest, I dont think he liked them that much... on chatting about stuff in general he mentioned that in the PakGym game he did, he almost threw "the captain" off the field for questioning one of his decisions. He didnt even know the captains name - presumably it was Rashid, for the game he did must have been 3-4 weeks ago).
None of us were in Milwaukee on Sunday, we dont know what the weather and light were like. I did look at MUCC's pictures...and I must admit they look quite bright (and as I mentioned I umpired on the same ground a week ago, and we played till 7:15). Maybe, as they said, there was a cloud that made it dark and the game was called off then... I dont know. But I really dont like the allegations of the umpire being biased here, or bought or whatever - the guy is from Florida, maybe he just has a different standard for brightness of light for play? :-) I believe they start games early in Florida, like 9am or something... so this may never even be an issue there (unlike here where weather is an issue, and we're playing 45 overs and starting at 11am for away matches!) Iam just saying, there may be a more mundane and non-conspiratal explanation, which I would rather look for than bias for one team in a qualified umpire who is pretty new to our league (and has little reason for bias).
I agree with you that its been a crazy three weeks with PakGym being in the middle of a lot of controversy here. But really... they wanted a reschedule of the MUCC game (most teams in their position would have wanted that), it was the management who agreed to move the date, Pak doesnt make that decision by themselves (even if I dont agree with the decision). The fight with Muslim... the punishments for that have already been handed down, and most of the league seems to think its a pretty decently-strong punishment. The bad-light issue this weekend... if it was really bright, maybe its a bit unsporting to ask for bad light, sure... but its the umpire's call that ended the game, not PakGyms. If it was something wrong, the responsibility of this cant really rest that much with the team in this case IMHO.
Anyway. Hopefully the runrate stuff will be resolved soon, and we'll have the playoffs set for this weekend - something to look forward to.
--------- cricket_lover said... Oh boy, another controversy! Here are the facts: Pts NRR Should be PAK 32 0.385 0.366 ROG 32 0.543 0.338
Something fishy here, do you smell it. Dal main kuch kala hain, yaa daal hi kali hain. --------
BTW, how were these numbers arrived at? If they are accurate, please give some more raw figures for it :-)
Actually, I think a *lot* of teams are getting iffy NRR's by inputting wrong things by mistake - if I was a member of any team that has NRR as an issue, Id check all my own scorecards again, and also all my opponents scorecards :-)
Just an example. I was looking at the Flames/Capitol scorecard today. Flames made 155 allout, listed at 38.5 overs (all allouts should be 40 overs for NRR calculations, surely). Then Capitol chased, and got 156/7 in 40 overs and won... eh? Did they win off the last ball? So I looked at bowling figures, and the overs add up to 34.4! So did *both* teams input wrong numbers by mistake in this case? It is probably only a smallish change in NRR in this instance, but this is only one game out of 14.
Note, this is Flames and Capitol... they are actually *tied* for second-from-bottom, and one of them is going to be relegated to Division Two on NRR (presumably Capitol)! When NRR is *that* important to the result of your season, surely the teams involved should check all their own and opponents cards, to make sure no mistakes were made in inputting numbers into the formula that gives us the NRR on the table! Heck, if I was truly desperate, Id even add up overs for bowling figures in all non-all-out innings to make sure they tallied with the number of overs actually used as input for the NRR formula :-)
Heck, with the Eagles alone - I think Ive travelled with them when they lost away games by 1 wicket and by 2 runs in the past... and we still stopped for dinner on the way back, and had pretty pleasant times overall. *** But Sadiq, you are talking about the Eagles here. What else will you expect.
********************** but its the umpire's call that ended the game, not PakGyms. *** My exact thoughts sadiq.
------- Does anyone know what happened yesterday's night fixture? Adnan, Faisal, anyone from AAA ------
I was there early on with some friends (game started a little late, due to fast-opening... is this going to regularly be the case for night-playoffs, BTW? ie 7:15 or 7:30 start time? Anyone know?)
Anyway. United batted first, and Ruchir blasted away - he ended up getting 84 or something IIRC. (He was like 82 and retired hurt, then went back later and was out within a couple runs). United scored very quickly, and were 130-odd in about 14 overs for only 2 or 3 wickets, but collapsed (and had 3-4 runouts) and ended up getting 177 I think. Anjuman's chase began well (but for Imran Tailor being cleanbowled by Mehul IIRC) and they were 50/1, but Ruchir then took 2 wickets in one over and it was like 55/3 in about 8 or 9 overs I think. Thats when my friends and I left, to drive to Khan's on Devon for a late dinner (which, if anyone is interested, was quite spectacularly good last night :-)
I echo mini - anyone with a result, please let us know :-) The asking-rate for Anjuman was pretty high, but they had big hitters like Bilal, Munaf etc still to come (they were also shorthanded last night, BTW - Hafez-bhai didnt play, as he is leading tarabi at the mosque every evening during Ramadan).
Tonight is Challengers-Flames, which should be a very good game. Flames night team ought to be pretty strong, as they have added Pradeep from Purdue (and maybe one or two more Purdue guys, not sure), and are getting 3-4 very good players from Milwaukee (Asif, Kabir, Riaz etc), and they still have Kiran, Nasir et al. And Challengers of course are Challengers - defending night champs, and as explosive a team as exists in the league who usually win without bothering to add anyone. Should be the most fun QF. (Though not the most anticipated game of the tournament... that is still going to be the semifinal between Pak and Muslim :-) Anyone know what day that is set for yet? Quite a battle in prospect there ;-)
I feel Owen Grey is one of the few umpires we have who can control the on-field happenings, not merely just umpire the game. He is assertive. He will certainly command respect with such qualities. Although he looks serious, he can be funny too as our experience pointed out. This was the game against Tigers - Preetam thinks he was given Chest Before Wicket !
A USACA certified umpire and this kind of behaviour - thats the standard of Umpiring.
I agree it's the Umpire's call and the batsman has the right to appeal for bad light anytime.
But as an Umpire would you purely go by what the batsman thinks. And was the Umpire so ignorant that he cannot see
whats going on. As an Umpire isn't it your duty to see that the game is played fairly ?
Atleast he could have said lets see for another couple of overs.
A spinner bowling. The batsman says he cannot see the bowl. The Umpire tells us " the batsman is saying he cannot see the ball " and take the bails off and calls of the match. The Umpire took less than a minute to call of the match.
And he said clearly to us that he is not coming back on the ground to resume the game.
Does that sound normal to you ? It's like you suddenly realised, its time to go home, lets call off the match. Bye Bye see you. And thats how it happened.
The Umpire never ever said what he thinks about the light. He kept saying "the batsman says". He never ever used his own judgement.
Last year MUCC vs Wildcats was a rain curtailed match. The cloud cover was always there.
This weekend when the match was called off, the light was much better as compared to MUCC vs Wildcats game last year. It's upto you to trust me or not.
You have umpired so many games in Milwaukee. You know the normal time the game gets over. At 5:35 pm all this started.
Sadiq bhai, thank you for an honest opinion - I had already made all those points but I guess people are more interested in who says it rather than focusing on the facts. As I understand it, the management is examining scorecards and re-calculating runrates right now, so we should know the final results by end of today or tomorrow morning(?). Pak v Muslim is presumably set for tomorrow night.
Heck with all the controversies- I would say let the management probe and decide it - let's talk about the story of the day. How'bout dhem Pakistanis! what a way to kick australia's behind. Way to go, Misbah (any more objection on his selection)! Love it, I don't care who beats Australia; but by Pakistanis. Wao, made my day!
- If a team is all out without utilizing all their overs, the full quota of overs available (45) is used in the NRR caluclations.
- The only time(s) exact overs (on the scorecard) are used for NRR is when a team successfully chases a target OR if the match is called off with the 2nd Inns incomplete.
Also, what are the rules regarding a "declaration" in ODI's? Shouldn't the full quota of available overs be used since the team chose not to bat on?
You are correct, NRR calculations are based on the complete number of overs (45 or 40 or whatever) if a team is all out. If they are chasing and complete it in less overs, then that lesser number counts.
However, I would like to remind everyone that although this may seem to change the NRR calculation in PG's favour, this needs to be applied to every single game. A cursory look shows that the calculations are not right for quite a few games for these 2 teams.
Adi, I have taken scores from all the matches played by United, Rogers Park and Pak Gym and applied that formula and have emailed a copy of the excel sheet to the management. The only bone of contention is the "declared" Inns of 379 in 27 overs. Do we count 27 or 40? According to my calculations the difference would only be elementary.
main issue under discussion is the unsportsman like conduct first appealing for bad light (at the moment there might a passing cloud) second is not returning to the ground after condition improved (you still had good hour and half left for play). umpire is from florida abviously he doesn't know the conditions looks like how dark it gets here then blue sky opens right after If win is all that a team is after they can have em all next year when none of the teams want to play a team what point in playing game itself when you know other team will do anything to scrape win with out any concern for the oppostion I am sorry to say that point I don't get and that the point bloggers are after that is the MUCC is pretty concerned about not playing the game in good spirit of it If its professional game where teams gets money I can understand this is a just competitive league where team want to play good competitive match fair and square get good investment of time at the end of day this is no way to win and that is why you guys don't deserve any respect what so ever
Firstly, you make it sound like I'm on the Flames's team.
Secondly, the next part of the plot is for me to send in Kiran, Asif, and Kabir to your "undisclosed" location because somehow I've figured it out. Meanwhile as they rescue Nasir, I'll let you keep beating the crap out of me, until Nasir shows up and then i'll suddenly become super human and turn the tables. Of course, in all this, Nasir can't walk because his legs are paralyzed!
Sound familiar? Kickboxer with van-damme! Sorry, but today's one of those weird days where my mind's off on it's own tangent.....
Sorry Shekhs, weekdays are a little tough for me. I have to be up early in the morning to be at work. My day usually starts at 5am. Hopefully this weekend. if you are playing.
Well well well, seems to me that at least a couple of matches were fixed this past weekend. Muslim Gym versus Rogers Park is an obvious giveaway due to shady characters on both sides. I am not entirely sure about United, mainly because the Chargers are pathetic. It's bad karma for both RP and MGCC, both teams will be "one and done" in the playoffs. Again, not sure about UCC because Chargers have stooped below all levels of mediocrity.
Guys, in keeping with the NRR calculation rules (MCC/ICC), I have checked all scorecards for Rogers Park, United and Pak Gym (teams tied on 32 points) and calculated the NRR as follows:
Pak: +0.607 United: +0.601 RP: +0.420
This was done using 40 overs for RP's 379 total and 2.1 for United's chase of 40. If we use 27 overs for RP's declared Inns and 3.1 overs for United then the numbers are:
RP: 0.570 United: 0.591
I have sent a copy of this sheet to the management and also to the editors of the blog so they can post it on here for your review etc.
------- Pak v Muslim is presumably set for tomorrow night. -------
Is it really? I had been under the impression that all semis were actually next week (and the "current week schedule" on the MCC page doesnt give much - it doesnt even list playoffs for day games for this weekend, and the only night game it lists this week is the one tonight between Challengers and Flames).
If it is certain that Pak and Muslim are playing tomorrow night, please let us know for sure on here ASAP :-) Plans for the evening will need to be reworked, to ensure presense at the Mother of All Battles :-)
Sadiq bhai, as of this afternoon the match has been moved to next week, so you may plan in advance! What is your email, you may review the excel sheet too and comment.
Ram, yes it would appear so, however I'm waiting for the management's take on it after they review the numbers, I don't wanna jump the gun right now.
----------- This weekend when the match was called off, the light was much better as compared to MUCC vs Wildcats game last year. It's upto you to trust me or not. You have umpired so many games in Milwaukee. You know the normal time the game gets over. At 5:35 pm all this started. Does all look fair to you ? Bhavneet MUCC ------
Bunty, I do trust you - Id probably trust you with my life, actually :-)
And I have umpired in Milwaukee a lot - had to do it too often, actually. As I said, I umpired at the same ground exactly 7 days before your game... and we played till 7:15 without either team mentioning the light. I remember the Wildcat game last year (I umpired that one too!).. it was cloudy all day, and we played all day with neither team raising any objection, of course. Which is why not many things about the end of the game look particularly fair to me at least (especially the pictures, which look quite bright).
All Iam saying is... as an umpire I find it hard to hear allegations of an umpire being paid off, or biased etc (and wanted to let Tango know that, in this one case at least, Owen was actually *not* travelling back with the visiting team either).
And Iam not saying PakGym is blameless here - they arent, IMHO they havent been blameless in any of the incidents over the past 3 weeks. But I dont believe the blame is all on them for this latest game, or even that a majority of the blame is on them... teams appeal for all sorts of things, that might make them unsporting. But the *decision* is not their fault, thats the umpires call. Similarly, I personally think the "reschedule" was totally wrong, and have said so on here before - some have agreed with me, others have totally disagreed with my opinion. With the "reschedule" too, PakGym is hardly blameless, they wanted it, they asked for it, they pushed for it... but the *decision* in the end was not made by them, thats all. (The third incident, the fight... ok, there is no "management" or "umpire" to shift the blame onto for that one, that one's all on them :-)
If what happened this weekend was wrong, then a large part of the blame does fall on the umpire, obviously (even as an umpire I cant wriggle out of that one :-) But I still find it hard to hear "bias", "bought" etc... it could have just been a mistake, we all make them. It could be different standards. My own standards, people have told me, are draconianly harsh - they feel that I make people play on when its too dark, too cloudy, too rainy etc (the Capitol folk, who I get along with very well and have a lot of respect for, very much feel that way after their game with you guys - they felt conditions were too difficult to play in, but I didnt think so, it was a hard call but it was my job to go with what I felt, and I did). I dont call off games easily - if it rains in the middle of the day, I'll often wait for an hour or two before calling anything off, even. Not everyone is like that, some umpires have different standards on what constitutes playable conditions. I realize it may sound like Iam making an excuse for a fellow umpire... maybe Iam. But I still say error in judgement or mistakes or different standards are more likely explanations than bias or corruption. Thats all.
Mehul, I am assuming the system does not count the overs properly in cases where teams are bowled out without batting out the full quota of overs. So to start with the 0.49 wasn't correct.
Hmm..I am not too sure about that. I thought as soon as you enter "all out" it takes in 40/45 overs to calculate. Also, if that is the case are you suggesting that NRR of all the teams might not be correct? If that is not true, then there is no way it can screw up only one team. The only way it can happen is if the scores are not entered in correctly in the first place. Correct me if I am wrong.
I can vouch for that as my team was in playoffs contention in 2005 .. and had done all the possible calculations and found no differences ... with what was showing on MCC website and the NRR calculation formulae available on ICC website ...
Mehul, I reviewed it and you are right, I have made a mistake with one of the scores. Our NRR turns out to be 0.409 (which still doesn't match the website one), but it would still leave us short of RP by a fraction. Sorry everyone!
-------- mehulshani said... Only thing I can say is you are opening a whole new can of worms. Good luck with Championship!! -------
It has all been seen before :-) Check out the points table for Division Two, 2005 regular season. That year 8 teams had 40 points or more... and the next 6 teams were all at 36 (ie 14 teams in all). So it was a run-rate battle.
Late in the season, teams discovered that their runrates were "wrong" - mistakes in inputting etc, basically I think things like opposition "130 allout in 25 overs" being listed as 25 overs rather than 40, and so on. There was an instance of a team in like 13th place working out what they had to win by, planning, executing it, and jumping to 12th... and then after that the former 12th team, *without playing a single game*, suddenly jumped to 10th because their runrate increased :-)
History, they say, first repeats itself as tragedy, and then as farce :-) (Alternately, what Division Two thinks today, Division One thinks tomorrow ;-)
I believe there was a movement after that crazy 2005 Div2 playoff situation to come up with a rule, that once you put in scorecards, you had a week or so to input them "properly" and/or correct them... and after that no changes could be made to NRRs etc. That, if you had input it wrongly and you true NRR was actually *lower*, it would be changed.. but if you were trying to increase your NRR late in the day saying "we made a mistake", it wouldnt be permitted. I dont know if that rule ever got into place or not (it should have, if it didnt).
That year, BTW, the final resolution was that an extra two "wildcard games" were added, and #10 thru #14 played each other in "play-in games" to reach the playoffs... IIRC, they played Saturday, and the winners played the actual playoff game on Sunday or some such. Maybe thats the solution. PakGym to play Rogers Park on Saturday in a play-in game, the winner to move onto the playoffs to take on St Louis on Sunday :-)
Seriously, this is all getting farcical, and is generally all quite crap. Last year Pak gave a walkover to enable Chargers to survive at the expense of Tigers, which sounded quite like a fixed game. This year Muslim shows up with 7 people against Rogers Park, to enable them to up their NRR and possibly eliminate Pak and/or United, which is surely another fixed game (at least by Muslim, if maybe not by RPCC). These things seriously need to be put an end to, once and for all.
I say in the offseason introduce a new rule - if any playoff team gives a walkover in the last 2-3 weeks, they are automatically out of the playoffs. If any team is found to have matchfixed and/or manipulated things (after investigation by the league, consultation with umpires and observers etc - showing up with 7/8 players is automatically considered matchfixing), the offending teams are out of the playoffs, plus penalties next year. If its one playoff team and one non-playoff team.. then both teams are out of playoffs obviously, but also next year the top rungetter and top wickettaker of each team is suspended for the first 3 games each. These things make a farce of our great game, and they must be fixed immediately, and the punishments should be draconian so that they never are even considered again. Throw teams out of playoffs starting next year.. the teams due to play them get a walkover in the quarters (no, #9 and #10 dont get to benefit from this sort of thing - they were #9 and #10, they dont deserve to make the playoffs anyway :-) Eliminate this nonsense once and for all from our league.
I did not know u could write something like this. You used to be always "politically" correct. I guess these events ne tere zamir ko hila daala aur asli sadiq bahar kud kar aa gaya. Welcome home!!!
For the first time I actually feel you are furious :)
Teams have to be penalized in such a way they pay for their mistakes.
Never mind the current NRR imbroglio (not suggesting it to dismiss it now), I do believe that the punishments meted out recently (with player suspensions) were very, very lenient - contrary to what you feel.
In order to prevent physical fights I think a one-year ban should be automatic. Imagine if one-season+ ban had been imposed on some players...that would have affected the teams this year and also next year. Nothing else would prevent the repeat of such fights.
I do not appreciate consistently calling our game with Muslim a fixed game. You umpired the United/Chargers game, the outcome of which is pretty extreme too, but nobody from our team has made any accusations. You were not at our game, how do you know what happened?
The fact is that Muslim played with 7 players and put us at an extreme advantage but that is not our fault. It is not match fixing!! Just like every other game, there was a league official at our game too. You have been taking advantage of the fact that no one from our team has responded to your comments. If you can prove any wrong doing, then speak, otherwise be neutral like you often claim to be. ---------------------------
Reading earlier blogs, Raheel's RR calculations don't seem to add up for me. Maybe I'm doing something wrong. I guess we will soon find out. Either way, good luck to all.
--------- Asmar said... Sadiq - I do not appreciate consistently calling our game with Muslim a fixed game. You umpired the United/Chargers game, the outcome of which is pretty extreme too, but nobody from our team has made any accusations. You were not at our game, how do you know what happened? The fact is that Muslim played with 7 players and put us at an extreme advantage but that is not our fault. It is not match fixing!! Just like every other game, there was a league official at our game too. You have been taking advantage of the fact that no one from our team has responded to your comments. If you can prove any wrong doing, then speak, otherwise be neutral like you often claim to be. ---------------------------
Asmar -in fact, if you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see I specifically absolved Rogers Park from blame. And, in real-life at least, Ive made this point to several people the last couple of days (at Hanover on Sunday and Monday, one umpiring and one watching part of the nightgame, where I got to talk to a fair few people)... that it isnt really Rogers Park's fault if their opposition shows up with 7 people, supposedly most of them non-regulars. If someone shows up without fielders and gives you easy bowling, what are you supposed to do, not hit it? Rogers Park hit it, and hit it very well - they cant be blamed for it in any way.
However, the idea that a team is showing up with 7 people and irregular ones at that.. surely thats a problem to start with? Muslim just used the rules as they currently are to the fullest - youre allowed to take the field with a minimum of 7 people, and nobody can control if youre playing regulars or not. Thus, we need to change the rules for next year IMHO - *something* must be done to avoid a team not trying to win, surely? (BTW, Iam presuming they werent trying to win based on the fact that they supposedly played 7 people, and non-regulars at that, which appears pretty damning. The league, Iam sure, will just talk to Anwer Khan and find out - he's a good umpire who knows what he's doing, he should be able to tell them how the game was played. But just showing up with 7 people appears pretty iffy to me, as Iam sure it does to most).
And youre right, the only game I can really talk about properly is the United/Chargers game which I umpired (if I had seen just the scorecard, Id probably have thought it was a quite shady game too, as you said :-) But at least Chargers played 11 players, and it was almost their full-strength lineup. They just batted poorly, and United bowled very very well on the day from what I saw.
BTW, I also think we're never really going to have "proof" one way or the other - what sort of proof can there be? There is no video or audio recording of Chargers talking to Pak Gym last year, and convincing them to stay home for the last game of the season - there never will be. Similarly we can never know whats in the mind of a team that shows up with 7 players, or their internal discussions. But what Iam saying is, we *have* to find a way to fix this thing for next year - this cant be allowed to happen every year. Put caveats into the rules in advance - and go with the best view of the observers in charge. But this general manipulation of things has got to be stopped.
(BTW, a lot of leagues around the country know that NRR is considered something easily manipulatable. So they have rules set in advance... if its a two-way tie, it is decided by head-to-head result between the teams - for playoffs, for relegation, whatever. If its a 3-way-tie, then the team that has beaten both other teams head-to-head goes thru. Sometimes even a third-tiebreaker of "results against common opponents" if neccessary etc. They all keep NRR as the *last* tiebreaker, simply because it is the most manipulatable and least fair way. Our league should IMHO do the same - but first, of course, we need to go to three divisions (because at the moment Div2 teams dont play half the other teams so there are many times when head-to-head never comes into the picture). That should be the first and most obvious change IMHO - we ought to go to three divisions, and head-to-head as the first tiebreaker.If you couldnt beat your closest opponent on the field, you dont deserve to get in just because your run-rate was better - what happened on the field should be of greatest importance.
={(total runs for team / total overs faced)- (total run against / total over bowled)} So in english: (1). Total runs scored by calculating team divided by total over faced by calculating team (2). Total run given by calculating team divided by total over bowled by calculating team. 3. simply now 1 minus 2 above.
Rogers Park: After assuming St. louis game played for 40 overs, capitol played for 40 overs, united game played for 35 overs, and royals game played for 40 overs. RP total score = 2027, overs faced 475.4 ...... 4.263 other teams scored = 2077, overs bowled 445.7 .... 4.660 Hence NRR for Rogers parks is: 0.3963
Now Pak Gym All game played for 45 overs
Pak total score = 1406, overs faced 330.5 ..... 4.254 other teams scored = 1522, overs bowled = 326.1 .... 4.667 Hence NRR for Pak Gym is: 0.413
Difference between Pak and Rogers Pak has + 0.0168
Congrats to Pak, you guys have made it to the playoffs....
Our league should IMHO do the same - but first, of course, we need to go to three divisions (because at the moment Div2 teams dont play half the other teams so there are many times when head-to-head never comes into the picture).
-----------------------------------
Had brought this up with Sridher recently in a casual conversation and the issue seems to be the # of grounds available for scheduling games.
Now in Div 2, we don't play about a dozen teams. If Div 2 is split into 2 and 3, then we need to add a dozen games, atleast per team in Div 3. The biggest stumbling block seems to be the availability of grounds.
I don't see Div 3 happening unless we get more grounds.
Blog Police can we have a new thread for Division 2 Playoff Talk. This blog is boring me with Pak Gymkhan's issue. 160 plus post and 99% on the same issue.
There is more happening in MCC in the coming week.
A. CCI vs IIT - IIT wins and wins it big. CCI's cinderella story ends here.
B. Evanston vs Advancers - Excellent game coming up. Both teams are in excellent form and well balanced. Evanston relies on pace more and Advancers is primarily spinners. I feel that Evanston wins this becaus they have Perrin.
C. Giants vs QC Kings - Giants played QC Kings few weeks back and that game ended in a draw Giants 219 in 40 for 7 Wickets / QC Kings 219 all out in 39.1 Overs. QC Kings is much improved team this year. I really like Pankag and his guys. Good people that want to play good cricket. I tell you this much, the winner of this game will play in the finals.
D. Jaguars vs Peoria - Jaguars can pull the rabbit out of the hat. I have seen these guys play and they play like a cohesive unit. Peoria is not different. My gut says Peoria will prevail.
I love you man, but you really annoy me sometimes when you intentionally/unintentionally misinterpret my statements.
Let me make one thing clear: I am not accusing Owen Gray of anything.
The only thing I said about him was…
Do you really expect us to believe that the umpire, Gary Owen, is not intimidated by the fact that he has a two-hour trip back to Chicago with the same Junglee’s who started a fight last week?
You made two valid corrections from my above statement. 1. His name is not Gary Owen, its Owen Gray. Sure, fine, you know better. I mean, I don’t eat, sleep and shit Midwestcricket like you. 2. He didn’t travel with Pak Gymkhana. Fine, does it really make a difference? Pak Gymkhana has a history of starting fights in the middle of the ground. And most of the times, they’ve gotten away with it.
As you yourself pointed out, this team has been involved in numerous such incidents before. The only time they got penalized was last week (correct me if I’m wrong here), when they picked up a fight against Muslim Gymkhana, a team who’s equally close to the President as them. These guys should have been suspended the first times they started a fight, not the fourth TIME.
Don’t you think it’s possible that the umpire might have been intimidated by the Pak Gymkhana players for the various reasons cited above? I sure as hell would.
Now, obviously there are a few umpires, like you, who won’t get intimidated by such hoodlums. Maybe that’s why they don’t let you umpire Pak Gymkhana games anymore. Sadiq, when was the last time you umpired a Pak Gymkhana game?
Let us also keep in mind the two sources of all our information. One is the Milwaukee United team, who has never been involved in any altercation before, atleast to my knowledge. I don’t think there is more sincere and honest guy in this league than Bunty.
On the other hand we have Pak Gymkhana, who has a history of cheating, fighting, unsportsmanlike behavior. *Sorry Raheel, I'd really like to see things from your point of view, but I can't seem to get my head that far up my ass.*
The game was called off at 5:50PM, and as Bunty pointed out, Pak Gymkhana started crying at 5:35PM. How ridiculous is that? I don’t care how many clouds there are in the sky, you don’t call off a game at 5:50PM, especially when the other team is on the verge of an easy win.
When you put all these things together, I can quiet confidently point out the guilty party.
++++++++++The fact is that Muslim played with 7 players and put us at an extreme advantage but that is not our fault. It is not match fixing!! Just like every other game, there was a league official at our game too. You have been taking advantage of the fact that no one from our team has responded to your comments. If you can prove any wrong doing, then speak, otherwise be neutral like you often claim to be. +++++++++++++++ Come on Asmar, the whole league knows what your team is capable of. Rogers Park can never score 379 runs even in 100 overs against any team, not even in 30/30. Dont be mad at Sadiq for speaking the truth, the whole league is talking about what a shameful thing your team has done. Sadiq is the only one who said it loud.
if anyone need a prove that rogerspark/muslim game is fixed check farhat & shiraz phone bill for past 3 weeks and u will find out plus one of the rogerspark player is almost everyday on farhat's house.
may be there should be a poll? Which team should be banned, "team which asks umpire for bad light to come to playoffs" or "teacm which fixes a game to come into playoffs"
We should invest more time devicing rules so that teams don't take the League and teams for ride with stupid personal agendas Div-I suppose to the elite group, now make everyone think is it really? It appears for any blogger reading that elite of Div i are nothing but bunch of sore loosers who don't know how to play cricket right Looking at Div-II teams have so much respect for each other NOT in one case did any one set up anything like in Div-I
Like C8w said we need to invest more time devicing rules this offseason with scenarios that come up like these and team indulging in farcical games should be penalized with season bans, not just 2or 3 games every team should think twice before monkeying around with the spirit of the game
Guys, first of all sorry for all the confusion yesterday, apparently my formula was correct, but I reversed the scores of one match and hence the erraneous NRR of 0.6. I still don't know how the system counts the overs. For calculator savvy people on here if you want these are the #s from matches (all our matches were 45 overs):
I am with Sadiq bhai on this, it seems that NRR is easily manipulated based on scorecards and how the overs are counted in the system. Head to head record should first be used for teams tied on points.
United is the second worst team in conceding runs in the top 13 teams in the league this year with Mehul in the line up for 80% of the games
Chargers has put up the 4th highest runs in all teams in this league at 2256, only behind batting giants like, Purdue, Challengers and Wildcats
Pak Gymkhana has the most rain out games and complained about not being able to play cricket and it is not fair but requesting to call off a game due to bad light that would be completed in all fairness. Each time PG is in trouble they have resolved to Rain and 20 overs whenever they can like the Phoenix game MG game last year in the QF where the ground was not quite playable and they insisited on continuing because they were well placed. Umpire allowed it (perhaps he was scared, rightly so to)
Rogers Park top score for the season has been 250 in 45 overs
AAA did not give a single Walkover all season long except for the last 2 games of the season, both of which if the had won, there was a possibility of avoiding relegation.
No Division 1 game has been called off due to Bad Light in at least the last 5 years of MCC (or maybe more), except for the final 2 years ago. Also where PG was involved and it was a 50 over game on Oct 16th 1 month from last Sunday, what an irony.
MG lowest total with all 11 players playing in a 45 over game is against St. Louis with Kamran, Imran and Rizwan in the lineup, at 149.
i am with c8w ( throw the teams out of the playoff ) but why wait next year put the investigation team and do it this year and if they find them guilty give the chance to next two teams which is phoenix & royals. But as we all know that mr.T.A. don't have guts do that.Because all 3 teams in the cotroversy is good friends with T.A. and the Admisntration.
All the umpires are asked to fax a copy of score-sheet to MCC after the match ... Does not MCC check the score-sheet and the scores entered on the site to see that they are in sync ..
Sorry, 19.1 not 19.2. I did the same for us by the way ... took all the scores directly from scorecards and didn't recalculate overs. So, what do you people think:
- Should Rogers park go ahead by a difference of less than 0.1% - A pre quarter final to decide the #8 position - Toss
The AAA game was a 45 over game. They were all out and possibly marked it their scorecard as 40. Even if we leave that as is, the MCC game was definitely 23 overs.
Add the number of overs bowled by all our bowlers and its 23. If the system does not calculate it that way, then that is definitely a mistake on MCC's part that needs to be fixed. I was under the impression that overs are counted using the opponents bowling stats.
If not, then you are right, let's just flip a coin )
I guess Raheel is right about the AAA game being 40 overs and not 45. As for the MCC VS RPCC game, MCC's batting card says 19.2 while RPCC's bowling sheet says 23 overs.
Also, i assume both of you are not converting the partially completed overs to the correct fraction. For example say 469.1 overs, meaning 469 overs + 1 ball will be 469+(1/6) for NRR calculations.
Taking into account this info..
PG NRR : 0.416451954 RPCC NRR (AAA game 40 ovs, MCC game 19.2 overs) : 0.416748046 RPCC NRR (AAA game 40 ovs, MCC game 23 overs): 0.451469314
I have not cross checked any of the data Asmar/Raheel posted. I cross checked Raheel's post with regs to RPCC matches and I am assuming Asmar will cross check all of Raheel's posts!!!
chal hat, I thought about that but wasn't sure if the Midwest system adjusted that, but good point - however as you can see the relative #s still stay the same: 0.416 v 0.417.
Asmar, I don't know the correct # of overs, but its recorded in the system as 19.1 and thats what we have to go by for now.
I hope this whole situation gets resolved ASAP one way or the other, I'm startin to get a headache!
Game highlights of ICC20/20 can be seen at www.worldtwenty20.com, this requires no downloads and of course this is not live but closest to live for free.
---------- ice_cold said... Come on Asmar, the whole league knows what your team is capable of. Rogers Park can never score 379 runs even in 100 overs against any team, not even in 30/30. Dont be mad at Sadiq for speaking the truth, the whole league is talking about what a shameful thing your team has done. Sadiq is the only one who said it loud. -------
Once again I'd like to clarify - this is exactly what I have *not* said (out loud, or softly :-)
I have plenty of respect for Rogers Park's batting - Ive seen Moti bat for several years, Kami is a terrific clean striker at the top of the order, Nasir is consistently good (Top 15 batting the past couple years IIRC), Mohd Al is a great pickup who improves the batting significantly too. What RPCC is, is its an aggressive team - Shiraz, Zeeshan etc, all go after the bowling a fair bit. They can sometimes get out early, but they can also tear an attack apart when theyre "on".
I have umpired games before when teams play with 10 men - its hard. And games with 9 fielders - there are yawning gaps in the field with even 9 fielders. With only 7 men playing... keeper, bowler, 3 men on offside, 2 men on legside...bowl to Kamran and Shiraz with that sort of field, there could be major-league carnage. If that same game is played again with only 7 men, there is likely to be a *huge* score posted by RPCC again - maybe 380, maybe not, but pretty damn huge probably. This is exactly why Ive said before, that I *dont* think this is RPCC's fault - someone shows up with no fielders and bowls pies at you, what are you supposed to do, not hit it?
The problem lies when a team shows up with only 7 guys in an important game, and that too supposedly non-regulars and kids. But, of course, by the letter of the law they didnt violate anything - youre allowed to play "new players" in regular season (just not in playoffs), and 7 in the minimum number you have to show up with to avoid a walkover. All the violated was the spirit of the game - violated it completely and totally.This is why the laws have to be changed, or caveats put in, by our league at the end of the season IMHO. We have to find a way to eliminate this stuff.
Someone must be in the zone that day to score 379. This calls for an immediate human harmone growth testing in MWCC prior to playoff. just kidding. Anything is possible in life, sir, so relax and if they scored 379 this shows this league has lot of mediocre team even in the so called league A.
225 comments:
1 – 200 of 225 Newer› Newest»Oh my I got to open this Playoff Innings .....
CCI vs Jolly Rovers - CCI scored 160 in 40 overs and that is all I know.
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Tonald Drump said...
Oh my I got to open this Playoff Innings .....
CCI vs Jolly Rovers - CCI scored 160 in 40 overs and that is all I know.
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I know more! I know more! Mostly because I umpired it :-)
In one of the biggest upsets IMHO, #12 CCI beat a very good #5 Jolly Rovers team today despite playing with only 10 men!
CCI arrived with only 10 - theyve apparently had 5 graduations, and 3 people were away this weekend etc. They opened steadily (with Manu and the 16-year-old Hassan), got a few bonus wides, and progressed to 33/0 in about 6 overs as a result. They then consolidated, got to 50/0 in about 13 overs before losing their first wicket, and slowly progressed on to about 100 or so in 30 overs with wickets in hand. Imran then hit 2 sixes in one over (14 off the over), then repeated the doze a couple overs later, hitting another 2 sixes in that over (16 off that over). He ended up getting 43 IIRC. Boosted by the opening partnership, some solid stuff in the middle, and the smacking by Imran at the end, CCI ended up with 160 in their 40 overs. It was a score that both sides seemed reasonably satisfied with - I had umpired Jolly Rovers last weekend when they chased down 190-odd quite easily in Madison, they have a long and good batting lineup usually (including two of the best bats in the league in Ram and Younus), and they must surely have been very confident.
CCI came out bowling very well, though, and JR lost both openers by the 3rd over - after 5 overs they were 6/2. From that situation nobody can play freely, you have to rebuild - and JR's two best bats, Younas and Ram did just that. Ram was eventually beaten by an incutter that clipped his pads on the way to the stumps - it was 45 or so for 3. Then, 2 overs before break, Younas was bowled too going for a big shot after playing an excellent innings (60+ for 4). Another wicket fell next over (19th)... and the first ball of the 20th saw Imran get another, at which point break was taken at 74/6! Jolly Rovers came back from break, and the new batsman was clean bowled second ball... and next ball Ravi tried a big shot and holed out. The 20th over ended with the score 75/8! A very good Jolly Rovers batting lineup had lost 3 wickets in 1 over, and 5 wickets in 3 overs... 5 batsmen in total got ducks for them, an astonishing number given their batting ability.
Jolly Rovers didnt fold, however - the #9 and #10 put their heads down and batted on quietly and steadily, adding 30 or so runs over the next 10 overs, leaving 56 to get in the last 10. They got to about 50 in 9 overs, before the #10 was stumped. The last man came in and batted on steadily too however... and eventually Jolly Rovers needed only about 30-odd more in 4+ overs when the last wicket finally fell stumped as well. In the end the middle-order collapse proved too much to overcome, despite a brave effort from the tail.
Overall a very good, intensely fought playoff game - and a big upset in the end. CCI has been in our league for 4 years now I think, and this must surely be their single best victory since joining our league - they beat a very good team, in a playoff, and to do it with 10 men was a remarkable achievement indeed. Having umpired Jolly Rovers for the first time this season last weekend, I had thought they looked good enough to be contenders for the whole thing - with Ram, Younus, Chit, Nachiket Sardesai and Ravi Patel, they had 5 former Division One players in their XI, and they were playing very well as a unit. But cricket can be a funny game, and playoff cricket can be even stranger - few things are harder than a target-chase in a playoff game after a couple of early wickets have gone down, and that was proved to the hilt today.
Three more playoff games, including some wonderful matchups, tomorrow. After what sound like pretty ridiculous shenanigans that reduced cricket to a farce at Heritage today, its nice that we have at least those well-fought playoff games to look forward to for this weekend :-)
c8w
Wildcats Vs Phoenix
Wildcats won the toss and elected to bat first in the final game of the regular season...I am wondering as to how quickly the season has come to an end.
WC started their innings nicely with Romeen and Sanjay taking time to settle themselves, and Romeen in particular was looking dangerous hitting a couple of big sixes. Priyank was bowling really well at that time troubling Romeen and Sanjay consistently but he was not lucky enough to grab a wicket.
Mithul brought himself on but they could not squeeze a wicket, and the introduction of Nikunj made the difference(He was bowling very well) as he got sanjay to slash at a wide ball and got him caught by the keeper. Sumeet came in 1st down played a couple of good shots and got out trying to clear the offside, then ajit came in next and he was playing well along with Romeen where both Nikunj and Fabian were bowling pretty good, ajit got out trying to clear a long hop from Nikunj and was caught by diwakar, all of a sudden we lost a good position to be in a bad situation loosing a couple of wickets regularly including Romeen,SP and we dragged ourselves to a good enough score of 185 with a very good and patient knock from Vikram who was guiding the tail to reach 185.
Sameer was a sporting person when he took one catch of Romeen and he claimed it was grounded and i(we) appreciate him for his sporting behaviour.
Phoenix started their chase and they were on the back foot right from the start and the Tormentor in Chief was none other than Satish who was bowling lightning quick while the ball was moving considerably, Fabian had a hard time trying to connect the ball and he got out slashing at a delivery and was caught well in the slips. Diwakar came in next and he got out to a good ball that moved away after pitching and gone in the slips.
Mithul the other opener was playing to the situation taking singles and rotating the strike, but he got a bout of cramps and he had to walk away.
Aditya and Athreya joined together at this time, and considering them to be 2 very good batsman the game was still very much on.
Satish again bowled a peach of a delivery to Aditya and he was caught behind the stumps, on the other end Athreya was playing dangerously taking chances and hitting on the up and he did get a life 4 times thanks twice to me :-).
Naveen and Athreya were playing sensibly taking singles and moving the score nicely, all of a sudden athreya hit a ball to midwicket and went for the run while Krishna made a good stop and threw the ball to the keeper and Naveen was well short of his crease.
Athreya was the lone hand contributing a well made 60 and he got out trying to clear the field, and the rest of the batting folded up after that.
This was a good game, was fun to be with the Phoenix guys and Aditya might give a better update in terms of other masala stuff or something i missed, onfield of field etc...
can someone provide updtaes for Second Division playoffs
I was at WP to see playoff games and know that Springfield were all out for like 70-80 or so. Don't know exact score.
First great game update by Sadiq Bhai.
Now onto Chicago Giants vs Springfield Update: We won the toss and elected to CHASE.
Sprinfield started decently and was like 20ish for no loss but then Asim got hot and ripped thru the top order with 4 wickets. Moshi took over where Asim left and got 3 wickets. In the end SP was all out for 77.
Giants chased the total down in 16 overs. Thanks to some great power hitting by Yaseen and Omer.
Another Update: Evanston Won vs Lucky XI. Also saw Jags in control of there game vs Madison. Jags scored 245ish .... lets see if somebody here can update us.
QC Kings we are coming for you baby.
Pak Gym played the "cry baby" cheating game and won the game by making a bad ligh excuse...they were 108/8 chasing 190. At 20 overs they were ahead by 6 runs (MUCC - 77 at 20) and were always waiting to get off the field. The umpire was there 12th player, he was biased!!! More coming up along with the pictures of the ground conditions...
It was a BLACK day in the league when PAK GYM & The Umpire Gray Owens teamed to come up with another controversy of the season. The conditions were perfect for a game but the umpire showed signs of being biased right from ball one of the match. Teams like PAK GYM & Gray Owens should be boycotted from the league...all the teams should sign a petition to ban pak gym from playing in Midwest league & also playoffs this season !!! Fair playing teams like MUCC have been suffering at the hands of cheaters & dirty tricks of Pak Gym. Last year was a similar situation when Hasan was 5 feet outside the crease & was not given run out by the pak gym leg umpire. How many teams will suffer b'cos of this....we are here to play cricket not dirty tricks with cheaters. I guess this is the first time MUCC is expessing their agony against such a team & expressing disappointment over the way things have happened.
This league has become a farse! There is no one to oversee any kind of rules. Pak gets to do whatever they want. Why? TA and his team needs to be thrown out at once... count your days current administration. it's the insane running the assylum right now!
m = mucc
I feel bad for MUCC, and on a personal note i dont think it would get so dark in the second innings by 31st over, i mean we played there last week and we pretty much finished the 40 over game with enough light to site the ball, I am not sure if the game started late or something else, but standard cricket conditions the game can be played unless there are some unknown facts..
Another week and another Pak Gymkhana Controversy. I myself getting a little tired of this BS.
Photos of the ground/light situation for Pak Gym Vs MUCC game at Lincoln.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/13656240@N02/
Light Condition seems to be excellent in the picture. Seems like all teams should bring a Digital Camera & Video Camera to every game they play against Pak Gymkhana. That seems to be the only way teams can show everyone how Pathetic this team really is.
Sad part is that they are pretty talented and do not need this type of cheap tricks. I guess Kuttay ki doom tehri ki tehri rahe gi.
Bad light is a draw. Both teams get 2 points.
Congratulations! Rogers Park.
Adnan Baig
United Cricket Club
First time blogger on these pages...though long time reader. It was very disappointing, and I couldn't believe the way the Pak team retreated behind the bad-light rule in the 31st over at around 6 pm with just a few dark clouds in horizon. I guess it was in sheer desperation at being in a losing situation, and one wonders to what depths this team can sink to win. At the cost of respect and fairplay ? On second thoughts, actually, we may be beyond the wondering point - given the reputations that they have created for themselves. I for one will never play a part in any game with Pak Gymkhana again...and I think quite a few of my team mates concur.
Well, the umpire also retreated with the Pak Gym team...wonder what interests he had ? He completely violated clause 13.1 by taking the bails off as soon as the batsman asked for light. Mr.Farmaan was asking Raheel in Urdu.."Bol de usko (umpire) ke light karaab hain?" As soon as they appealed for light...bails were taken off. This is Fixing to the core. They could not spot a red cherry in ample light..color blind I guess. Badri I agree with you MUCC will not play PAK in futur...I hope they are banned from Div 1 after everyone signs a petition.fyi...clause 13.1 below
13.1. Umpire shall exercise proper judgment and wait as long as possible to give both teams a fair chance to complete the game.
Well after watching the pictures i just have say that this is not the way i wanted to play cricket, and its really sad that MUCC had to face this when they are playing a good host even going to the extent of rescheduling the game. I guess the league should rent flood lights for the playoff´s since i am sure the light would be much worse in the coming days... and who knows who all will have a problem sighting the ball in such light..
I have to agree with Adnan about the 2 points to be shared, this is not a rained out game so to my knowledge(Which is rather short) it should be a tie and cannot be decided by the 20 over rule, i might be ignorant on that rule in MCC some one can shed more light on this rule...
All in all we want to play Hard but at the same time Fair...
Cover_drive : but the Cavet here is if you read them properly it also talks about 13.2.1. which is not clear as to what would happen if both teams play 20 overs, it was either a mistake or they did not think of this situation.
I am not sure if 13.2 will take precedence over 13.2.1 or how it works...
Someone who knows about these rules might shed some light.
Is this the first time such a situation happend, if it already happend in the league then we might already know what the rule is. Anyone any past memories...
Adnan,
No Congratulations buddy.
I'm afraid the game was awarded to Pak Gym as shown in the scorecards without much regard for rules.
P.S. The pictures in the link above are great!!
This has happened in the league before in a Final some time ago between a certain rogers park and you guessed it Pak Gymkhana. If you log on to MCC Archives you will see that the Championship is shared by both teams in 1996 because of an incomplete final due to bad light. I don't know if this has ever happened again with a game that is so critical. The pictures milwaukee united posted look pretty good and if the league is not going to do anything about it this means that the management is just giving Pak Gymkhana a clear hand to do whatever they want in this league. Although we are in division 2 we still aspire to come to Divsion 1 sometime this year or next. And if things are run by a single team in Divsion 1 like this where if you don't accomodate them, they will either beat you up or scheme things against you illegally than we are better off quitting this whole thing altogether. This is indeed has been a sad weekend for cricket in this league. First the Rogers Park Run fest against a 7 strong Muslim Gymkhana team that placed them well for playoffs positioning; than a United and Chargers comeback with a fixing of their own, with United routing Chargers on 39 and getting the score in 2.1 Overs to improve thier run rate factoring all things; and finally Pak Gymkhana pulling the oldest trick out of the hat for claiming bad light at 8 down with 80 runs to go with 2 pretty useless wickets remaining. Today I am ashamed to be part of this Cricketing Feternity
WELL IT'S FOR ALL THOSE WHO ARE SAYING AGAINST PAK GYM
WHAT HAPPENED TO ROGERS PARK THEY WON BY 326 RUNS AND GOT MUSLIM GYM OUT AT 54....NO ONE SAYS A WORD
CHARGERS SCORED 40 AND UNITED MADE THOSE RUNS IN 2-1 OVERS....NO ONE SAYS A WORD....
I WONDER WHY U GUYS R AGAINST PAK GYM....
BATSMEN CUD'T LOCATE THE BALL CUZ IT WAS VERY CLOUDY ( u can change the pics contrast n stuff ) N ALSO THE BACKGROUND WAS FULL OF TREES...WHICH WAS WORST IN THAT SITUATION...
MILWAUKEE UNITED TOOK ALOT OF TIME TO FINISH THOSE OVERS...SO IT'S THEIR OWN FAULT...
IT WAS A GENUINE REASON UNLIKE THOSE 2 PRE-PLANNED GAMES...NO BODY BOTHERS TO TALK ABT THOSE GAMES...
THAT'S JUST WEIRD TO ME...LET ME TELL U THAT UMPIRE TOOK WICKETS OFF EXACTLY AT 6:20 PM....
This is Bhavneet from MUCC.
Facts:
The game was being played in the right spirit till the drinks break of the Pak Gym innings. At 20 overs, they were 83/4 while chasing the target of 190. Then a collapse happened. And as I see it, the moment Irfan Sohail got out ( all their main batsmen back to the pavilion ), Pak Gym had a feeling that they might lose the game.
Time:around 5:35pm
They slumped to 109/8 in 31.1 overs. Farman and Raheel (who jut came in) were at the crease. Sadiq who was our only fast bowler operating at that time had just finished his 9 overs. I bowled the first bowl of the 32nd over that was down the leg and hit the batsman on his pad. He told the umpire that he could not see the ball. In my previous over ( 30th over) Farman hit a boundary and they got another couple of runs.
The Umpire told us that the batsman cannot see the bowl and indicated that the game is over. He then removed the bails and told our captain that he is not coming back to ground to resume the game.
In all the matches played here in Miwaukee, games have usually gone past 7 pm. Th Umpire told us that he has called the management and they suggested him to act as per ICC rule. There was no effort to wait for light to get better ( it was not bad at all in th first place ).
TIme: 5:50 pm Game awarded to PAk Gym.
Time 6:40 I was at home.
The game had sunked to a new low.
Todays match was my last match against Pak Gym. I am not playing against them any more. And MUCC feels the same. I am not a professional cricketer. I am here to play fair cricket in the right spirit of the game. Winnig and losing are secondary. I and MUCC have never been involved in any controversies. This is the first time we are expressing our point of view.
More importantly I lost respect for some highly talented and senior palyers.
Another game another story: MUCC vs Capitol. Though facing relegtion, the Umpire and the Capitol team along with MUCC team made all the necessary efforts to finish the game despite of numerous rain interruptions. Capitol lost the game and game finished at around 8:30 pm.
The only motive there was to play cricket. HATS OFF TO THE CAPITOL TEAM for their spirit of the game.
Last year MCC vs Wildcats. Lincoln was unplayable due to rain. All efforts were made to play. Eventually both the teams drove to WHITEWATER and game was completed by around 8 pm. KUDOS TO THE SPIRIT OF THE GAME.
Thats why I am here. To enjoy the game of cricket.
You all are good enough to draw the conclusions.
HonestCricketer: Regarding ball not being visible, last week around the same time WC was playing against MCC at the very same ground, and the climatic conditions were not any different from what they were today i guess, and when a spinner is bowling do you really think it would be dark enough for someone to sight the ball even if the time was 6:30 PM, and for your information i was batting at one end in the 39th over of the game when a medium pacer was bowling and i could sight the ball, and it would have been well past the 6:30 PM mark you are talking about.
Regarding Chargers Vs United i was watching the game if not the complete game atleast a part of it and to my eye it did not look like one fixed, we should give credit to the bowlers who bowled their heart out, and to the team as a whole to be in contention.
I am pretty new to the league and to the organization which goes around this league, I might also get a few haters for what i am saying but the bottom line is i want to play fair, and its upto each individual´s logic as to how they want to play.
I would like to take a different perspective on this incident. The Pak Gymkhana batsmen at the crease when this incident happened did something that teams has been doing for years, even in international matches, however unsportsmanlike or unfair it may seem to the others. Who has not seen on TV, the blinking eyes, hollow stares and what-not-gestures of batsmen at the crease trying to covince the umpires that the light is so bad that they can't even see their hands. So specially for a team that knew victory is a must for their passage to the playoffs, that they are ahead at the 20 over stage, that they are in the doldrums having lost 8 wkts and that bad light is the only way they can be saved, I was expecting this to happen. In fact I wonder how many other teams in the league would not have resorted to appealing against bad light in such a situation. However few that would not have, should be appreciated for their attitude towards the game but unfortunately the truth in my opinion is that there are very few around.
Now comes the most disheartening part of the whole incident. The bastmen can appeal as much as they want but it is the umpire who has to call the shots fairly for both the teams. In this incident the umpire involved showed a distasteful partiality by taking off the bails as soon as the batsmen appealed and not waiting for the light to improve nor wanting to come back and resume the game. The fact was the so called detorioration at that point was caused by a passing cloud and things did actually get even better within 10 minutes as the sun came out from behind the clouds. On top of that the umpire showed great attitude by boasting of his USACA certfication credentials and threatning to have MUCC players who were protesting his decision with bans. I would care less for a certification from our wonderful USACA, known as one of the most corrupt cricketing governing bodies in the world who had their funding taken away by ICC.
It was clear that the umpire had ulterior motives in this entire episode and did want a particular team to get away with four points from this match. I am further ashamed that this was a so called neutral umpire from the league. The petition and boycotts that everyone is talking about should be against this UMPIRE first and foremost. Whether the team involved had asked the umpire to take such a decision is a matter of conjecture, but having no evidence or having actually seen that happen, I would blame the entire fiasco on the umpire.
Bad light is a very subjective matter to the two teams on the field and their relative positions of strength in that phase of the game and there have been quite a few controversies in international cricket over the ages. No wonder finally ICC came up with the light meter to atleast standardize some of the decision making.
Whatever the umpire did and the way he did it leaves a very bad taste in the mouth and is not a good sign for the well being of this league that has grown so much in the last few years. There are these few incidents like this and the so called match fixing in the last round, that needs to be seriously addressed by the management and the league as a whole if it wants to portray a fair playing enviroment for everyone that enjoys cricket. Otherwise the day will not be far when we will see the growth of new leagues in the midwest catering to teams and indiviudals that are disgusted with the way things are turning out here.
Let me dis-spell any myths that people may have about United. We will never stoop to the level of putting the integrity of the game in question. We came out Sunday with the intent and understanding of what we needed to do to achieve a task. Our bowlers bowled their hearts out! Mehul in particular looked like a spring chicken and was unplayable. Our newest addition Yousuf was excellent in support and matched shani's intensity. Dhiraj took an amazing catch at mid-on to dismiss rafi, who was looking dangerous. We were absolutely focused and united as to the cause at hand. Sadiq can shed light on this, we played fair and honest cricket. As captain of the team i take great offense at any suggestions that would involve any sort of match fixing!
We play hard and fair, and anyone that knows us, knows we would never involve ourselves in those circumstances.
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naren said...
HonestCricketer: Regarding ball not being visible, last week around the same time WC was playing against MCC at the very same ground, and the climatic conditions were not any different from what they were today i guess, and when a spinner is bowling do you really think it would be dark enough for someone to sight the ball even if the time was 6:30 PM, and for your information i was batting at one end in the 39th over of the game when a medium pacer was bowling and i could sight the ball, and it would have been well past the 6:30 PM mark you are talking about.
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Let me preface this by saying I wasnt in Milwaukee today - so I dont know the climatic conditions, or the light conditions *today*.
However, Id like to say Naren is a little wrong above... I was umpiring the game he played last week at Lincoln Park, and when he was batting in the 39th over, it was not 6:30 pm. It was actually a little past 7:00 pm :-)
That was a top-of-the-table contest between Wildcats and Milwaukee CC, and a *terrific* game. The ground conditions were not great, we started an hour late (like after 12 for an 11am start), and played a 40-over game. Milwaukee made 143 IIRC. Wildcats *started* their innings only about 4:00 or so (partly because the umpire had to move his car during lunch-break due to the presence of cops :-) The Wildcats were ahead by 4 runs at 20-over break IIRC... but they lost wickets afterwards, and
the game got very tight. Eventually the Wildcats ended up needing 21 in 3 overs with only 2 wickets in hand IIRC, and the clock had ticked to just past 7pm (at the start of the game, the MCC guys had told me light was good until 7, which was why all had agreed to play a 40-over game to begin with). Eventually, at about 7:15 or so IIRC, the match ended with the Wildcats losing by a mere 2 runs (as a result of which they will not end top of the table for the season). To their enormous and everlasting credit, not one single time did a *single* Wildcat batsman even mention to me that the light may have been getting just a little dull by 7:15pm, despite the fact that a bad-light calloff would mean they got 4 points from the game. I remember chatting with Nikhil as we walked off, his valiant unbeaten innings having just fallen short of glory... and I remember saying to him that the game had been everything a top-of-the-table clash should be - tightly fought, good cricket, good spirit, in doubt till the last ball, played in fading light etc, and his response (*after* the game had ended) was that he might have had to mention the light if a paceman was bowling, but with spinners bowling the last 3 overs (even at 7:15pm) the light had been playable so he hadnt needed to appeal. This was last Sunday, exactly a week ago, at the same venue as yesterday as Naren said. Though, once again, I wasnt in Milwaukee yesterday - I have no way of knowing if the weather was cloudier, the conditions darker etc... just to say that Naren's "6:30 pm end of the game last weekend" actually *underrates* the time, it was nearer 7:15 (I know this well, cos I wanted to watch the 7:30ish start of the Cowboys-Giants Sunday Night Game last weekend... and I ended up missing a large chunk of it despite going to a nearby Wisconsin sportsbar :-)
c8w
we have played MUCC and they are the best sporting team in MWCC and it is indeed dishearting to hear that they have to go through sort of ordeal Its very sad to hear that good teams always end up last we have to change this trend sooner or later this getting more and more rediculous day by day there are no code of ethics absolutely and due to all these controversies, teams who are playing hard, winning it right getting tarnished for no mistake of their own MWCC cup is what Pak gym is afer why not just buy them cup in the beginning of the season and reward it them so they will save rest of us from stupid stuff like these incidents like these make people question why they are playing cricket in the first place during this long summer season with stupid teams who do not care about rules or ethics dont know how to play fair this very sad episode in the hisotry of MWCC
Ice_cold,
I am sorry but that is totally uncalled for. Please do not start another controversy. We are already inundated with a few.
Coming to the Pak_gym game...i am going to play the devils advocate. The team is tainted so it is easy to blame them. I totally agree with DIEHARDFAN. Pak_gym in my view did everything that they had to do to win this game. Every team does that. It happened to us too but luckily we had an umpire who knew the rules. It might not be in the right spirit of the game but I think it is right within the rules. It is really for the umpire to decide whether a game can continue or not. If there is a passing cloud he most certainly should wait for it to pass. That is ICC RULES. they check back if there is enough light to continue playing.
This Owen Gray i think is the same guy who gave me out Chest-before-wicket once.
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Naren said:
Regarding Chargers Vs United i was watching the game if not the complete game atleast a part of it and to my eye it did not look like one fixed, we should give credit to the bowlers who bowled their heart out, and to the team as a whole to be in contention.
---------
I actually watched the entire game, since I umpired it :-) The Chargers won the toss and batted (which Faisal seemed quite disappointed about, since he had mentioned to me before going in that they needed to win by 120 runs - he was *really* hoping to win the toss I think). United took the field... and the first 4 or 5 overs that Mehul bowled were probably the best pace bowling Ive seen in any game Ive umpired in the last 2 or 3 years at least. Anyway Mehul is one of the better pacemen in the league - yesterday it was as if he was bowling with this intensely focussed fury :-) The pace was significantly up, and he had the ball on a string, quite literally making it talk. He swung the ball both ways at will - bowled maybe 4 or 5 balls (left arm over) that the batsmen prodded at and missed just about off-stump line, which the keeper actually collected almost in front of first slip - ie the ball didnt just angle away, it actually swung away more than a foot or two by the time it reached the keeper (one of the Chargers mentioned to me after the game that "lambi-lambi swing ho rahi thi" :-) And he swung the ball back into the righty so often and so prodigiously that 3 of his wickets were righthanders who were clean-bowleds, one of them leaving the ball alone outside offstump (and one very very loud shout for LBW was turned down because the umpire thought it was swinging in too much, and might have missed legstump, much to the bowlers chagrin :-). Mehul quite literally looked as if he could get 2 or 3 wickets an over yesterday early on - its one of the rare times figures of 8-0-14-4 actually didnt quite reflect how well the bowler bowled :-)
The Chargers had XI guys, and pretty much their normal full team (though a few were apparently playing while fasting etc). They didnt have anything to play for, and did change their batting order around, but pretty much everyone played (I think they were missing only Hilal, their regular opener and offie, and I think one other player who has gone back to college or something... but most of their normal XI played). However they lost wickets early, and things just seemed to snowball on them from there (they were mentioning afterwards that this has been a big problem for them, they collapsed to 70 in St Louis a couple weeks ago etc). They opened with Reid, who often bats low in the order - he was out in the 3rd or 4th over IIRC, pulling at a short one and top-edging. Then Mehul clean-bowled Sami, the Chargers regular opener (who has opened for about 10 years in our league).. a gorgeous ball, left arm over, swung in late, went between bat-and-pad as he defended forward and took his stumps. In came captain Javed... and his first ball was pitched very full, outside offstump, he left it alone, and it curled back and took his offstump. Rafi was batting at this stage (he scored a century against Flames a couple weeks ago, and has been batting up the order since I believe).. next over from Yousuf he absolutely *smoked* a ball over midwicket, just smashed it.. and Dhiraj leaped up, extended his arms full over his head, and caught it one-handed (and immediately asked for ice to fix the damaged hand :-) Ive umpired Dhiraj only for 2 or 3 years (with IIT and then with United) so I obviously cant be sure, but I'll bet an Usmaniya-biryani that he hasnt caught a better catch in his life :-) Suddenly Chargers were like 4-down for 7 or so as a result!
Then Yousuf bowling at the other end broke the innings back - he bowls excellent leg-cutters often, and the ball yesterday was swinging a *lot* (it was chilly still at 10am, and quite breezy at times). Yousuf legcut it quite a bit yesterday, enough that he occasionally had a wide-outside-off problem with it. Kamran's second ball, I think, he got a legcutter that pitched middle-legish and removed his offstump - he had gotten squared up and a bit tangled trying to defend it, but the ball was quite the jaffa. And very next delivery, his brother Irfan's first ball was in the corridor outside off, he drove, and got a thin edge thru to the keeper - that was the heart of the batting right there. Next over another Mehul inswinger removed middlestump, and suddenly the Chargers were reduced to 22/7 in 10 overs. The Chargers tried to bat on (Mehul and Yusuf bowled 7 overs on the trot apiece, but they had tired and werent quite as effective after their first 5 each IMHO) - Iqbal hung around a long time, the batsmen defended and took singles and took the innings past waterbreak, but could only end with 39 at the end (Mehul finished it getting the last man plumb LBW). United decided at break that they wanted to get the runs as quickly as possible to make absolutely sure on runrate, and came out swinging for the fences with their two 20/20 openers - the first runs were actually a pullattempt on the first ball that went over the keepers head for four - and United cantered home getting the target in the 4th over.
After that it was all down to runrate calculations - they had brought a laptop to the field :-) Final positions were all up in the air, but they seemed to think they were into the playoffs, and maybe ahead of Pak Gym unless Pak won by a big margin in Milwaukee.
Not everyone has inputted all the scorecards yet - do we know final positions on the table already? At least the first 4 seem set, but the bottom 4 we dont really know the order yet, do we?
c8w
A thought !!
If the 2nd innings of the match has progressed beyond 30 overs mark .. before play abandons ... why not we take the 30 ver score as benchmark for deciding the game result ??
In fact .. after 20 overs .. the match result should be decided based on every over ...
Sadiq sir .. your thoughts on this ??
Since devising a duckworth-lewis kind of formulae would be extremely difficult .. this could be extremely good method ...
So why not use the duckworth-lewis system ? The tables are available for free and the calculations are not that difficult.
Personally however, I don't think we need to overly complicate things as long as the teams don't misuse the 20 over rule. And I know most of the teams are pretty fair when it comes to completing a game. Everyone of us makes some sacrifice or other to play...i hate to see a day wasted on an incomplete game.
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Alpesh said...
A thought !!
If the 2nd innings of the match has progressed beyond 30 overs mark .. before play abandons ... why not we take the 30 ver score as benchmark for deciding the game result ??
In fact .. after 20 overs .. the match result should be decided based on every over ...
Sadiq sir .. your thoughts on this ??
Since devising a duckworth-lewis kind of formulae would be extremely difficult .. this could be extremely good method ...
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In fact, something very like this was suggested last year at the Umpire Training course, by the guy teaching the course (he is an international umpire, and had also conducted a course and umpired some games in Michigan, before Sridhar got him over here to help train).
His suggestion was... after 20 overs, compare 20 over score. But after, say, 26 overs, compare 25 over scores. If say 32 overs have been bowled, compare 30-over scores. If 36 overs have been bowled, compare 35-over scores. And so on. If its too difficult to compare after every over... then, fairer than 20-over-comparisons at least, would be the "nearest round-number-over-comparisons", ie every 5-overs the comparison changes. And he felt that wouldnt be too hard for even umpires - they could ask score every 5 overs and note down in each innings, not too much more work. (Every over comparison would be too difficult for umpires to keep... and some teams dont have scorers, it it still comparable with our current scoresheets etc, but sometimes some folk dont fill in "end of over total" after every single over while scoring, even though they should).
The above is not the best system either - IMHO anything that totally ignores wickets lost cannot be a really good system - but it is clearly at least an incremental improvement over our current abysmal "lets go back to 20 overs and look" system. I do remember suggesting this idea during the AGM last year, but it didnt seem to have many takers, Iam not sure why.
BTW, does anyone know all the details/results of the playoff games played yesterday? There are no updates on the site, and all we have so far is a Giants report (thanks a ton-ald), a brief mention of Evanston possibly beating Lucky, and no final result of the big Jaguars-Madison game.
Also BTW, Alpesh, please call either Marghoob-bhai or me tonight, or else email or something. I mentioned to him on Friday that you were willing to umpire this weekend... but neither of us still had your number since you moved to Seattle etc :-)
c8w
Yesterday's incident led me to delve a little more into the D-L method and contrary to my so-held belief, it was not that complicated, specially since the standard resource conversion tables are all available at ICC and other web sites. The umpires armed with this table and simple instructions on how to calculate the par score can do it easily in my opinion. By the way the par score for Pak Gymkhana when the match ended last evening was 158 (My first attempt at D-L calculations). And they were 110/8 and won :(
Sadiq,
All the playoff scores that were played last weekend have been updated on the website.
Thanks for piquing my interest "Cricket is my life"...I never realized it was so simple and fast to do the D/L calculations !
D/L table is here:
http://www.icc-cricket.com/icc/rules/d-l_table.pdf
Match situation:
MUCC 190/8 in 45 overs
Pak Gym 110/8 in 31.1 overs.
1) Use 95% as total resource % available for 45 over matches (per the D/L table)
2) For overs remaining (calculate using only completed overs) and wickets lost, look up resource % value from D/L table. In this case, Pak Gym had 14 overs remaining and had lost 8 wickets.
3) Value from D/L table is 11.8
4) Subtract: 95 - 11.8 = 83.2 %
5) Calculate 83.2% of 190 (which is MUCC score) to get the par score => 190 * 0.832 = 158.080
6) Round lower and add one run to get the target win score (at the end of 31 overs).
158.080 => 158 => 158 + 1 = 159
You are forgetting the most important part of D/L here: those numbers are based on last few (3 or 5 I forget) year of data from the international matches! It has no relevence in our league - you need someone to calculate a 'par' score for our league by getting into lst few years' data and then crunching those numbers!
By the way here is a photo of Milwaukee conditions from our perspective: http://www.flickr.com/photos/31497260@N00/1397932650/
Pictures can be used/edited to prove anything - stop abusing Pak Gym and take up your issue with the umpire, who we don't really know very well, he just umpired in one other match for us vs Bears.
Who want to add confusion to an already confused league? Implement the D/L rules and create a better discipliniary committee,they will be needed then as well.
pics can lie not skies mr raheel go look blue sun shining sky in the pics that mucc posted and your pic. you guys stoop to the level no can in this league We all know what kind of team mucc is and they having come to this blog to post their frustration tells us one and only one thing you guys have brought this beautiful to the lowest ebb in entire league period
Compare the pic Raheel posted to IMG_2321 MUCC posted.
When MUCC took the picture there was no Pak Gym Player there. They were all in their cars getting ready to head back. Lets assume that Pak Gym took the picture they posted themselves ( when no MUCC player was there ).
In that case they knew excatly what picture MUCC has taken. So they went to same spot from where MUCC took the picture and said " Smile Please".
OR is it pure coincidence that both the pics are the exact same except for ........(please guess the difference yourself).
Am done on this issue now.
Mr Raheel and Company Good luck for the games ahead.
Bhavneet
MUCC
Firstly, my intent in using the MUCC vs Pak Gym game situation was to show how easy it is to use the D/L method and that it can/should be adopted by our league.
Secondly, there are 2 versions of the D/L method - the professional (which requires a software) and the standard (which uses the D/L tables). Per the D/L website: "For innings when the side batting first (Team 1) score at or below the average for top level cricket (which would be about 235 for an uninterrupted 50-over innings), the results of applying the Professional Edition are generally similar to those from the Standard Edition.".
I don't think there will be too many to dispute that if our league played 50 overs a side, the average score would be around or less than 235.
They way you are trying to creep into the playoffs is sad. You just picked one of the pictures from MUCC and enhanced it to proof your point. If things were any different you would have used your own equipment to capture your own pictures. Since things were not in your favor you did what you wanted to do and get away with it. Rumor has it the Owen was paid-off and called TA and TA authorize him with freedom to act in the interest of Pak Gymkhana since PG has been on the management case for handing down the suspensions. So by taking the right decision management will pay through decsions like these in the favor of PG to keep them off their backs. If the MCC MGMNT. let this slide, it will be a clear indication of being on the backfoot with PG. Honest Cricketer / mohd bakshi of pg, what happened to your guarantees of PG beating MUCC you were right by hook or crook you have beaten them and the spirit of cricket also in the process
Looks like the picture taken by us has been modified by Pak Gym guys. The teams who have played against us know that we don't have any interest in modifying the pictures as mentioned in earlier comments by someone. Anyone can make out, I don't know if they have the ability of being invisible because I did not see anyone standing beside me while taking the picture, so Pak Gym guys stop fooling around....
Change your behavior if you expect a team to write a letter of recommendation so that your banned players can play in playoffs...
MUCC
Hi guys,
What's new? Naren, read your summary, and I have nothing to add except that I enjoyed playing the Cats. Very sporting team, who fights hard. And the umpire had a pretty good game as well, I'm not sure that there were any players on either side that were unhappy with his decisions!
Good luck to you guys, and I hope that you make it to the finals. Although I support Cats and Challengers, I'd love to see UCC take home their first Championship. Good luck to all.
Just wanted to add that Romeen had a good knock and Satish bowled brilliantly. So did Naren, but he wasn't as successful!
Have mucc guys taken this issue to the management or is it still just being discussed here until management takes a decision after playoffs is done
m, s, mini, badri,
Firstly, I like the nicknames. :)
Are you guys planning to take this matter any further? I do have a lot of respect for MUCC and the spirit with which you play the game. It seems that the Umpire's actions definitely can be questioned and should be. We've had some particularly poor umpires in the past and I don't see them umpiring any more (thankfully). Maybe this umpire deserves the same scrutiny?
Either way, I'm sorry that you guys had such a bad experience.
There is a reason why Pak Gym is the most hated team in this league. Calling them defending champions is a disgrace to the league. I don’t know what satisfaction there is getting four points like this. The league will do well without teams like Pak Gym playing in it.
Mr. Owen Gray – Please don’t say you are USACA certified anywhere else. It’s funny. Umpire is supposed to run the game in all fairness and make sure the game is completed. Not run away as soon as the batsman says he can’t see a spinner’s ball in very well playable light. There were playable conditions, the light was good even after 45 minutes after we left the field. Next time, atleast don’t be so obvious. Do some acting, learn from Pak.
Pak Gymkhana - Please take Pak out of your team name. You are bringing disrepute to a country by your cheap, dirty tricks. And to think that some of you have taken a break for Namaz (prayers) during the game and still gladly do this…that’s unexplainable!
We really kicked your ass yesterday, didnt we!! atleast we have the satisfaction...
News from the Grapevine....Sachin is the next Captain.
We at MUCC have made a decision to boycott Pak Gymkhana team. We will never play a game with Pak Gymkhana in future. If the game is scheduled then congratulations to Pak! They are already on the points table with 4 points for next year... I hope teams follow suit and boycott them, there is no place for teams like this in this beautiful game.
There have been obvious violations by the umpire and unsportsman like conduct by the Pak Gymkhana team. MUCC lodged a formal complaint to the management (and judicial commt) and we will do whatever it takes to get justice done.
Prasad
MUCC.
Looks like AAA and Capitol are coming back to Div 2 next year...and the Flames seemed to have just been saved by their marginally higher Nrr over Capitol.
So I guess Satha will be back to his usual self of clobbering around the Div 2 bowlers all over the park(s).
What I dont get is how come the website showed that Pak gymkhana's game with AAA was supposed to be last week and also that AAA had received the walk-over from PG but instead the same game was rescheduled to this past weekend and this time AAA gave the walkover to PG...which just helped PG for their playoff race.
*hit always keeps circling around PG all year and every year. Even them being the defending champions in this league earns them no respect with all the tactics they manage to get involved in every year. Good luck to all the teams that ever face this "above the law" team.
Raheel how did your conscience even agree to what Farmaan was saying "bol de usko (umpire) ke dikh nahi raha hain". btw crappy job in changing the pic MUCC took.
Lets count the # of teams that want Pak Gym out of this league.I think if more than 10 teams vote out Pak Gym, then they should be banned.
1.Muslim Gym
2.MUCC
3.United...can anyone confirm from United
Lets add to this list & see if we can throw the dirt out of this league....sorry I mean cheaters out of this league.
I thought it was clear that I had taken the same picture and adjusted the brightness and contrast - just to show that you can't trust pictures. Appealing to an umpire for light is no different than appealing for an lbw or ct behind decision, he can approve or deny and in cricket you have to live with the decision. I'm glad you have the satisfaction Mr. Sadiq, may be now you can shut up because you're totally satisfied.
The issue has been raised with the management and we are waiting to hear back from them.
Interestingly, as another of my team mates pointed out, there is no mention of using the scores at the end of 20 overs to decide the winner of a game in the MCC ground rules !
Adi: Thanks for rubbing in the salt of me not performing upto ur expectations ;-), I can take it anyday given final outcome..
All the best for you guys for the next season and see you around at the playoff's
Good job Mr. Sherlock Holmes.
I am not Sadiq by the way. Just like your bowling, you bowled a wide down the leg here also. Way off mark here...
After what you guys did yesterday, you should be ashamed of yourself for coming to the blog and talking about it.
I thought you are one decent guy in this team of goons. I was thinking you would change your team, looks like you are fitting in really well.
Farman just appealed to the umpire that he couldn't sight the ball and the umpire agreed the conditions weren't playable - take it up with the umpire and management. If the umpire had said no the conditions are fine, we would've played on. We hardly know the guy, he has just moved here from FL or something and defintely not buddies with us. I'm done talking on this subject, good luck with getting us "banned".
Raheel...this proves that you are buddies with the umpire....none of us knew that he is from FL.Kitne paise diye usko...100,200? Don't worry no one is going to be there to play against you even if you dont get banned...just play book cricket in that case. Do you think you own this league?
Lets get the ball rolling to throw Pak Gym out of this league...the count is 3 for now & sign a petition before the playoffs begin
1.Muslim Gym
2.MUCC
3.United...can anyone confirm from United
Naren,
No salt in the wounds.... for all the wounds are ours!
Teams,
Let me make this "I told you so" statement.
Last year, Pak Gym players failed to wake up to go and play the game they love so much. Raheel's defence of the action was enough proof of...you know what.
Asmar,
So is true, your team should now be in the playoffs. Looking at the points table, if you update the last game's score against Muslim Gymkhana...u should go above PG right?
Can you confirm or let us know if there are any hidden decisions that is stopping you guys from being in the playoffs?
Thanks
Simon D, I firmly believe giving a walkover is a team's right if they choose to do so and shouldn't be anyone else's business. Like AAA gave 2 this weekend! And like Eagles gave us one last season in a night match.
That story is old .. move on .. a lot of teams in all divisions give walkovers for whatever reason, its their decision and right to play or not to play.
Raheel,
For the pictures to be modified they have to be saved on the computer. So if you have a doubt, we still have the photos in the camera/phone.
So stop speaking crap. Go and take some classes to play the fair game of cricket...
Ban Pak Gym!!!
MUCC
m, please state which exact rule did we violate or how we "cheated"? If you have proof that we bribed the umpire then bring it forward, otherwise its just speculation and you have no case. If you think the decision was wrong thats between you and the umpire! You probably think that by saying "ban Pak Gym" repeatedly it will come true! I wouldn't hold my breath.
"ban pak gym"....sounds like my chines cousin's name.
Story may be old, and its your right to give walkover. But your team's character was questioned last year and is being questioned again. That's the point. There's no smoke without fire.
I haven't seen MUCC guys active on the blog so far. But look at this week.
In that case you're way behind the rest simon D, you're still in the questioning phase, people have already passed judgement that we cheat, bribe umpires and what not.
I am in the "I told you so" phase. You just misunderstood. Don't get confused. You need to prepare for you team's goonish behavior in the playoffs. Get on with it.
Sadiq Sir .. send me ur email id .. so that I can mail you my number ..
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Cleo said...
Asmar,
So is true, your team should now be in the playoffs. Looking at the points table, if you update the last game's score against Muslim Gymkhana...u should go above PG right?
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Actually, its so close that we wont know till the scorecards are uploaded, I think!
Most of us had presumed, even on Saturday, that Pak Gym only needed to win to make it, since their Net Run Rate was above Rogers Parks and Uniteds (and their NRR couldnt drop after winning, it cant). But this one has actually been an exception! Because, of course, they won on 20-over rule, and the NRR is decided on the game played right uptil the interruption (thus for this game Pak Gym got 110 in 30/31 overs, while MUCC got 190 in 45 overs... thus, despite winning, Pak Gyms runrate was lower than their opponents for this one game, and their overall NRR unusually actually *dropped* after this game!)
Pak Gym's NRR was IIRC something like +0.46 or so before this weekend, and now its +0.401 (theyve updated their scorecard).
Rogers Park hasnt updated its scorecard yet, nor has Muslim Gym, so we dont know what exactly their totals were this weekend. Going by the approximate totals mentioned on the blog.. a quick back-of-the-envelope calcuation (using 380 and 55 in 40 overs for the MG/RPCC game) gives about +0.397 for RPCC's NRR.
With *approximate* scores used, the NRR differential is 0.003!!
This is a staggeringly small number - and thus until the actual detailed scores are uploaded, we wont know exactly what it all works out to. I mean, I plugged in 380 and 55... what if it was actually 385 and 45 (and not exactly what we heard on the blog? The actual cards need to be examined).
Iam sure Asmar and Rogers Park are furiously checking scorecards right now to make sure everything is accurate (for both them and Pak Gym :-) I mean, just take this latest Pak Gym game vs MUCC... Pak Gym's scorecard says they scored 110/8 in 30 overs, MUCC says it was 109/8 in 31.1 overs. When the NRR differential is 0.003... who knows what even miniscule discrepancies such as 1.1 overs in the scorecards amount to?
I would join Cleo in urging RPCC and MGCC to upload their scorecard from this weekend... we're all dying with curiosity to know what the final figures actually are :-)
c8w
Shekhs, Romeen
What are your playoff matchups in the first round?
Raheel said...
Farman just appealed to the umpire that he couldn't sight the ball and the umpire agreed the conditions weren't playable - take it up with the umpire and management. If the umpire had said no the conditions are fine, we would've played on. We hardly know the guy, he has just moved here from FL or something and defintely not buddies with us. I'm done talking on this subject, good luck with getting us "banned".
I won’t insult your intelligence by suggesting that you really believe what you just said. This is the third straight week your team has done something imprudent. But way to go, it sure takes some mettle to backup your teammates.
I know you feel obligated to come on this blog and give us the "Pak Gymkhana perspective", since you’re the only guy in team who can speak more than three words of English. (The rest of the guys are still stuck on "Yes", "No", and "Titties") But buddy, how many strikes do you guys need?
Lets look back at all the events over the past three weeks.
1. You reschedule a washed-out game against Milwaukee United.
2. Your teammates attack and beat the crap out of Muslim Gymkhana players.
3. You call-off a game because of ‘bad-light’ at 5:50 PM
You still expect us to believe anything your team says?
Raheel, you’re a sensible guy (before you get all excited, let me make one thing clear: “sensible” doesn’t necessarily mean “smart”, you can sensible and stupid at the same time.) Your stupidity is renowned, but I was under the impression that you had a little bit of commonsense.
Do you really expect us to believe that a game can actually be called off at 5:50pm in mid-September because of bad-light?
Do you really expect us to believe that the umpire, Gary Owen, is not intimidated by the fact that he has a two-hour trip back to Chicago with the same Junglee’s who started a fight last week?
Raheel, I like you. People say I've got no taste, but I like you…seriously. Just don't let your mind wander - it's far too small to be let out on its own.
Tango,
I like your writing style. I'd like to meet you during the off-season. Please honor me with your consent, will you?
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Adnan said...
Bad light is a draw. Both teams get 2 points.
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Adnan,
this is news to me. I thought the 20-0ver rule is applied in this case.
cmc,
relax dude...what has TA and his team got to do with what happened in Milwaukee over the weekend? Think about this, they got to deal with this kind of shit as well on a voluntary basis.
Tango,
you are so right about everything but i have a question for MWCC?
when PAK beats the crap out of Muslim why Muslim guy got suspended? for cursing i just dont understand how much more this league going to protect Pak. i think someone said TA should start counting his days. i think its time we need some new People to run this league and see what they have to offer.
This just in:
United and Rogers Park is in and the not so lovely Pak Gymkhana have done everything in their power to get in the playoffs but they could not.
Congratulations to United and Rogers Park, not so smart in the end are you PG
Probably Pak Gym are not that good in Maths, otherwise they would have done something with NRR.
We are done on this topic...
Good luck to all the teams in Playoffs!!!
and congratulations to Madhu and Peoria team for making it to Div-1..
MUCC
Congratulations to United and Rogers Park for sealing the last spots of the Playoffs!! Hopefully there are no further issues!!
One thing is for sure, there will be a NEW CHAMPION this year! May the best team win.
Good Luck to the playoff teams!
Well.. now I am convinced....there is something called divine justice!!!
Good luck to all the playoff teams!!
ASMAR SAID
Congratulations to United and Rogers Park for sealing the last spots of the Playoffs!! Hopefully there are no further issues!!
One thing is for sure, there will be a NEW CHAMPION this year! May the best team win.
SO NOW U GYS R WORRIED ABT ISSUES...SINCE U CREATED URSELF...
I THINK U GUYS SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF URSELF..WHT U GUYS HAVE DONE IS NOT IN THE SPIRIT OF THE GAME...
MAKING 379 IN JUST 27 OVERS THAT IS JUST BULL S**T...
MANAGEMENT IS GOTTA DO SOMETHING ABT THIS
what can i say abt muslim gym.....their team has only got bunch of phussies...
writing on the blog under different names n saying stuff abt pak that just shows their character...
ahahah cry me a river, listen honest cricketer, i am sorry lieing cricketer, i mean mohd baksi, u can keep crying and do name calling but guess what u are outta playofff, na na bu boo!!! mommy i didnt make it to playooff cuz other teams are better then ours!!! so beg and plea to tairq but u are not gonan play, sorry i forgot the most important one bribe the umpire!!!! ur a wus ur self!!!!! All the tactics and tantrums ur team has thrown, u are still out and united and rogers park are in go F urself, EVEN TA COULDNT SAVE U THIS TIME ITS A MATTER OF TIME UR TEAM WILL VANISH FROM THIS LEAUGE. REMEBER ONE WORD KARMA!!!
MR.ASMAR
well management should look over our game that we played yesterday...they won't find anything wrong wid that....on the other hand u gays making 379 in 27 overs that's suspicious and also i think that game was played under the right spirit of the game (corret me if i am wrong)...management shud luk into that...
if that's how it's gonna go then we don't mind letting u guys play against muslim gym in night semi final...
I STILL CAN'T STOP LAUGHING THAT ROGERS PARK MADE 379....HAHAHAHA
we would be more then welcome to share our score books to any one the umpire has orignals, we won bottom line and we in playoff!!! So ur predection was wrong so suck on ur thumb and learn to write more words!!!!
Ram,
We are playing Purdue in our QFs - a tough matchup.
Purdue is a young team, and play extremely smart, so we have to play smart.
Its going to be a good game!
Thanks for the wishes!
Stop by if you can. You too Preetam...
Howz everybody else doing?
Didnt feel like bloggin for a few days..
Congrats and good luck to all the teams that made playoffs in both divisions!
We have just couple of more weeks of cricket left, lets make the best outta it...
Guys guys.. lets keep the blog clean. Do not indulge in personal attacks of any kind on the blog.
Also, please do not make us administrators have to police each and every comment that gets added. If this continues, we will have to shut down the option of adding comments, thereby robbing the genuine ones that we can all share. So please, keep it clean and professional.
I have deleted a few of the posts that I was able to spot quickly that contained personal attacks of varying magnitude.
Good luck Shekhs. Wasn't worth blogging the last two days, eh?
Purdue, good luck to you too.
---------
m said...
Probably Pak Gym are not that good in Maths, otherwise they would have done something with NRR.
We are done on this topic...
---------
Asmar said...
Congratulations to United and Rogers Park for sealing the last spots of the Playoffs!! Hopefully there are no further issues!!
--------
I know Pak Gym (maybe for good reasons) have become whipping boys on this blog for the past few weeks, and so many detractors are glad to see what they think is "divine justice" and Pak missing the playoffs.
But, at least on the surface... surely there must be *some* questions about the above? I must say, I find myself confused as to how the above NRR's were arrived at.
First, I note, Pak Gym's NRR has dropped further since my last post this evening - the "30 overs" against MUCC was actually 31.2 overs presumably, and so they have dropped to 0.385 NRR. This is probably the most accurate reflection of their true NRR. (A good point was made tonight, however - if a match is being decided based on 20-overs, doesnt it make sense to use only the scores of those first 20-overs for NRR calculation as well? It is surely counterintuitive to have a team win and yet *drop* on NRR so much. But thats a different point entirely).
However, in re Rogers Park's NRR... how come they played only 27 overs in all? Its a 40-over game, isnt it? And they batted first, didnt they? If they were allout in 27 overs... that counts as having played 40 overs for calcuating NRR. Even if someone was retired hurt or something.. its a 40-over game, you cant bat first and "declare" after 27 overs as far as I know, if you bat first you have surely played all 40 overs, havent you? (Iam sure Muslim Gym didnt bat all 40 overs in making 54 allout, but for NRR purposes an allout counts as having batted 40 overs here too).
The updated scorecard (which is giving us Rogers Park NRR as 0.543 currently)... thats been calculated by the formula after 27 overs were input as RPCC's innings in this game. It changes quite a bit if they are listed as having played 40 overs, as they should be, surely?
I understand most PakGym detractors are over the moon at them being edged out on NRR... but lets be fair here. If we ask hard questions to Pak about how they arrived at their NRR's, we have to ask the same hard questions of everyone else in the race too. So I hope Asmar doesnt mind if I ask him about the above - Iam just curious what the explanation is about how the NRR was arrived at, is all.
c8w
Should be calculated based on 45 overs. League standard is 45 not 40 unless the umpire approved it as 40 due to weather.
Adnan Baig
United Cricket Club
Adi,
you our Ump tonite?
If the scorecard for PG and RPCC are checked and validated, it seems the 31.1 overs are correct as reported by the bowling team. The total overs bowled by them is 31.1 so PG nrr is correct.
For RP if the nrr is calculated based on 40 and not 27, they still edge out PG by some difference. Nice catch c8w, although I don't think much will change for the Playoffs. PG will still be out and RP and United still be in. I for one am ready for Playoff bshing. Hopefully Management can adress this and get going with the planning of the playoffs either ways. I think one of the better games for the plyoffs will be Challengers and Purdue. I think Purdue will edge out Challengers, St. Louis will take care of business against RP, United will win over Milwaukee and Muslim will win over the Wildcats. Let the Games begin.
Does anyone know what happened yesterday's night fixture? Adnan, Faisal, anyone from AAA
FYI:
No rules in ICC or MCC for declaring an innings batting first and what happens with the nrr calculation. Also no rule in MCC for counting nrr ofr 20 overs when 31.1 are bowled. If these issues are raised they will should be addressed for all teams in all games wither rained out or appropriated by the 20 over rule.
Something terribly wrong with this league...now with all the insults...why is TA not chucking in. There has to be a reason...they gain we fell the pain,and we come here and fight like little girls.
Oh boy, another controversy!
Here are the facts:
Pts NRR Should be
PAK 32 0.385 0.366
ROG 32 0.543 0.338
Something fishy here, do you smell it.
Dal main kuch kala hain, yaa daal hi kali hain.
---------
Tango said...
Lets look back at all the events over the past three weeks.
1. You reschedule a washed-out game against Milwaukee United.
2. Your teammates attack and beat the crap out of Muslim Gymkhana players.
3. You call-off a game because of ‘bad-light’ at 5:50 PM
You still expect us to believe anything your team says?
Do you really expect us to believe that a game can actually be called off at 5:50pm in mid-September because of bad-light?
Do you really expect us to believe that the umpire, Gary Owen, is not intimidated by the fact that he has a two-hour trip back to Chicago with the same Junglee’s who started a fight last week?
------------
Nice to have you back, Tango. And I hope I never get on your bad side, it would be bloody scary with your ability to evicerate people with the pen :-) (jab baccha raat ko rota hai, to maa kehti hai so ja, so ja, nahin to tango aa jayega :-)
Still, I shall be brave enough to play devil's advocate to you above :-)
First, BTW, its Owen Gray who is the umpire I think. He is a USACA qualified umpire from Florida who came here a few weeks ago, he umpires on a regular basis at a pretty high level in Florida supposedly - he has umpired the past few weeks for us in our league.
Second, Owen Gray travels to games on his own, and travels back on his own. Thus, he would have no fear of any "I have to travel back with these guys" theory that you suggested. (As an umpire myself, BTW, I have travelled innumerable times with both Div1 and Div2 teams that ended up losing away games, and I travelled back with them. Ive never made a decision on the field based on fear of what the travel back would be like myself, at any rate :-) Most people in the league are pretty good guys really - despite losses Ive never had any unpleasant drives back with anyone, I dont think (well, maybe one time, out of dozens of such games... but that team isnt in the league anymore anyway).Heck, with the Eagles alone - I think Ive travelled with them when they lost away games by 1 wicket and by 2 runs in the past... and we still stopped for dinner on the way back, and had pretty pleasant times overall.
I umpired with Owen on Saturday - we did the CCI/Jolly Rovers playoff game together. He's a pretty decent guy, and did a fine job umpiring that game at least. He has, IIRC, only umpired one Pak Gym game before this weekend - he doesnt really know them much (and, in fact, to be honest, I dont think he liked them that much... on chatting about stuff in general he mentioned that in the PakGym game he did, he almost threw "the captain" off the field for questioning one of his decisions. He didnt even know the captains name - presumably it was Rashid, for the game he did must have been 3-4 weeks ago).
None of us were in Milwaukee on Sunday, we dont know what the weather and light were like. I did look at MUCC's pictures...and I must admit they look quite bright (and as I mentioned I umpired on the same ground a week ago, and we played till 7:15). Maybe, as they said, there was a cloud that made it dark and the game was called off then... I dont know. But I really dont like the allegations of the umpire being biased here, or bought or whatever - the guy is from Florida, maybe he just has a different standard for brightness of light for play? :-) I believe they start games early in Florida, like 9am or something... so this may never even be an issue there (unlike here where weather is an issue, and we're playing 45 overs and starting at 11am for away matches!) Iam just saying, there may be a more mundane and non-conspiratal explanation, which I would rather look for than bias for one team in a qualified umpire who is pretty new to our league (and has little reason for bias).
I agree with you that its been a crazy three weeks with PakGym being in the middle of a lot of controversy here. But really... they wanted a reschedule of the MUCC game (most teams in their position would have wanted that), it was the management who agreed to move the date, Pak doesnt make that decision by themselves (even if I dont agree with the decision). The fight with Muslim... the punishments for that have already been handed down, and most of the league seems to think its a pretty decently-strong punishment. The bad-light issue this weekend... if it was really bright, maybe its a bit unsporting to ask for bad light, sure... but its the umpire's call that ended the game, not PakGyms. If it was something wrong, the responsibility of this cant really rest that much with the team in this case IMHO.
Anyway. Hopefully the runrate stuff will be resolved soon, and we'll have the playoffs set for this weekend - something to look forward to.
c8w
---------
cricket_lover said...
Oh boy, another controversy!
Here are the facts:
Pts NRR Should be
PAK 32 0.385 0.366
ROG 32 0.543 0.338
Something fishy here, do you smell it.
Dal main kuch kala hain, yaa daal hi kali hain.
--------
BTW, how were these numbers arrived at? If they are accurate, please give some more raw figures for it :-)
Actually, I think a *lot* of teams are getting iffy NRR's by inputting wrong things by mistake - if I was a member of any team that has NRR as an issue, Id check all my own scorecards again, and also all my opponents scorecards :-)
Just an example. I was looking at the Flames/Capitol scorecard today. Flames made 155 allout, listed at 38.5 overs (all allouts should be 40 overs for NRR calculations, surely). Then Capitol chased, and got 156/7 in 40 overs and won... eh? Did they win off the last ball? So I looked at bowling figures, and the overs add up to 34.4! So did *both* teams input wrong numbers by mistake in this case? It is probably only a smallish change in NRR in this instance, but this is only one game out of 14.
Note, this is Flames and Capitol... they are actually *tied* for second-from-bottom, and one of them is going to be relegated to Division Two on NRR (presumably Capitol)! When NRR is *that* important to the result of your season, surely the teams involved should check all their own and opponents cards, to make sure no mistakes were made in inputting numbers into the formula that gives us the NRR on the table! Heck, if I was truly desperate, Id even add up overs for bowling figures in all non-all-out innings to make sure they tallied with the number of overs actually used as input for the NRR formula :-)
c8w
Heck, with the Eagles alone - I think Ive travelled with them when they lost away games by 1 wicket and by 2 runs in the past... and we still stopped for dinner on the way back, and had pretty pleasant times overall.
***
But Sadiq, you are talking about the Eagles here. What else will you expect.
**********************
but its the umpire's call that ended the game, not PakGyms.
***
My exact thoughts sadiq.
-------
Does anyone know what happened yesterday's night fixture? Adnan, Faisal, anyone from AAA
------
I was there early on with some friends (game started a little late, due to fast-opening... is this going to regularly be the case for night-playoffs, BTW? ie 7:15 or 7:30 start time? Anyone know?)
Anyway. United batted first, and Ruchir blasted away - he ended up getting 84 or something IIRC. (He was like 82 and retired hurt, then went back later and was out within a couple runs). United scored very quickly, and were 130-odd in about 14 overs for only 2 or 3 wickets, but collapsed (and had 3-4 runouts) and ended up getting 177 I think. Anjuman's chase began well (but for Imran Tailor being cleanbowled by Mehul IIRC) and they were 50/1, but Ruchir then took 2 wickets in one over and it was like 55/3 in about 8 or 9 overs I think. Thats when my friends and I left, to drive to Khan's on Devon for a late dinner (which, if anyone is interested, was quite spectacularly good last night :-)
I echo mini - anyone with a result, please let us know :-) The asking-rate for Anjuman was pretty high, but they had big hitters like Bilal, Munaf etc still to come (they were also shorthanded last night, BTW - Hafez-bhai didnt play, as he is leading tarabi at the mosque every evening during Ramadan).
Tonight is Challengers-Flames, which should be a very good game. Flames night team ought to be pretty strong, as they have added Pradeep from Purdue (and maybe one or two more Purdue guys, not sure), and are getting 3-4 very good players from Milwaukee (Asif, Kabir, Riaz etc), and they still have Kiran, Nasir et al. And Challengers of course are Challengers - defending night champs, and as explosive a team as exists in the league who usually win without bothering to add anyone. Should be the most fun QF. (Though not the most anticipated game of the tournament... that is still going to be the semifinal between Pak and Muslim :-) Anyone know what day that is set for yet? Quite a battle in prospect there ;-)
c8w
I feel Owen Grey is one of the few umpires we have who can control the on-field happenings, not merely just umpire the game. He is assertive. He will certainly command respect with such qualities. Although he looks serious, he can be funny too as our experience pointed out. This was the game against Tigers - Preetam thinks he was given Chest Before Wicket !
C8W
A USACA certified umpire and this kind of behaviour - thats the standard of Umpiring.
I agree it's the Umpire's call and the batsman has the right to appeal for bad light anytime.
But as an Umpire would you purely go by what the batsman thinks. And was the Umpire so ignorant that he cannot see
whats going on. As an Umpire isn't it your duty to see that the game is played fairly ?
Atleast he could have said lets see for another couple of overs.
A spinner bowling. The batsman says he cannot see the bowl. The Umpire tells us
" the batsman is saying he cannot see the ball " and take the bails off and calls of the match.
The Umpire took less than a minute to call of the match.
And he said clearly to us that he is not coming back on the ground to resume the game.
Does that sound normal to you ? It's like you suddenly realised, its time to go home, lets call off the match. Bye Bye see you. And thats how it happened.
The Umpire never ever said what he thinks about the light. He kept saying "the batsman says". He never ever used his own judgement.
Last year MUCC vs Wildcats was a rain curtailed match. The cloud cover was always there.
This weekend when the match was called off, the light was much better as compared to MUCC vs Wildcats game last year. It's upto you to trust me or not.
You have umpired so many games in Milwaukee. You know the normal time the game gets over. At 5:35 pm all this started.
Does all look fair to you ?
Bhavneet
MUCC
Sadiq bhai, thank you for an honest opinion - I had already made all those points but I guess people are more interested in who says it rather than focusing on the facts.
As I understand it, the management is examining scorecards and re-calculating runrates right now, so we should know the final results by end of today or tomorrow morning(?). Pak v Muslim is presumably set for tomorrow night.
Heck with all the controversies- I would say let the management probe and decide it - let's talk about the story of the day.
How'bout dhem Pakistanis! what a way to kick australia's behind. Way to go, Misbah (any more objection on his selection)!
Love it, I don't care who beats Australia; but by Pakistanis. Wao, made my day!
Sadiq Sir,
I guess our website NRR calculation formulae does round-off the total number of overs to 40/45 if a team gets allout.
Sadiq bhai correct me if I'm wrong.
- If a team is all out without utilizing all their overs, the full quota of overs available (45) is used in the NRR caluclations.
- The only time(s) exact overs (on the scorecard) are used for NRR is when a team successfully chases a target OR if the match is called off with the 2nd Inns incomplete.
Also, what are the rules regarding a "declaration" in ODI's? Shouldn't the full quota of available overs be used since the team chose not to bat on?
Guys,
A quick update. United ended up beating Anjuman by quite a bit. About 100 odd runs.
Aditya
Shekhs,
Yes, I am. I have already told Tushar the secret of favourable decisions.... :-)
Aditya
Raheel,
You are correct, NRR calculations are based on the complete number of overs (45 or 40 or whatever) if a team is all out. If they are chasing and complete it in less overs, then that lesser number counts.
However, I would like to remind everyone that although this may seem to change the NRR calculation in PG's favour, this needs to be applied to every single game. A cursory look shows that the calculations are not right for quite a few games for these 2 teams.
Adi, I have taken scores from all the matches played by United, Rogers Park and Pak Gym and applied that formula and have emailed a copy of the excel sheet to the management. The only bone of contention is the "declared" Inns of 379 in 27 overs. Do we count 27 or 40? According to my calculations the difference would only be elementary.
main issue under discussion is the unsportsman like conduct first appealing for bad light (at the moment there might a passing cloud) second is not returning to the ground after condition improved (you still had good hour and half left for play). umpire is from florida abviously he doesn't know the conditions looks like how dark it gets here then blue sky opens right after If win is all that a team is after they can have em all next year when none of the teams want to play a team what point in playing game itself when you know other team will do anything to scrape win with out any concern for the oppostion I am sorry to say that point I don't get and that the point bloggers are after that is the MUCC is pretty concerned about not playing the game in good spirit of it If its professional game where teams gets money I can understand this is a just competitive league where team want to play good competitive match fair and square get good investment of time at the end of day this is no way to win and that is why you guys don't deserve any respect what so ever
Adi,
We already kidnapped Nasir..and he is held in an undisclosed location..
So if we take care of you...we got the game...aiite...
:-)
Will do..
see ya tonite..
Shekhs, your behavior is violating Rule Book 2, Volume 876, clause 5, section 3, paragraph 10, line 22
do u have a game tonight, Shekhs?
Oh my Gawd!!
I forgot about that violation...!
I guess we are doomed..!
Ram, are you in CA?
try to make it tonite, if you're in town..
Yeah Preetam...
Come on over...
Lets have a post game party..
Shekhs,
Firstly, you make it sound like I'm on the Flames's team.
Secondly, the next part of the plot is for me to send in Kiran, Asif, and Kabir to your "undisclosed" location because somehow I've figured it out. Meanwhile as they rescue Nasir, I'll let you keep beating the crap out of me, until Nasir shows up and then i'll suddenly become super human and turn the tables. Of course, in all this, Nasir can't walk because his legs are paralyzed!
Sound familiar? Kickboxer with van-damme! Sorry, but today's one of those weird days where my mind's off on it's own tangent.....
Either ways, see you at the game!
Shekhs, in Seattle, can't make it dude.
You're getting a bit carried away..
;-)
Oh yeah...this Flames is loaded..got more than one star...
I said Nasir, thinking he might respond...guess he is getting ready for the game..
see you @ the game..
No problem Ram..
Give us a holler when you are in Town..
Shekhs,
That would have been funny if he'd responded from his "undisclosed" location. See you at the game.
Sorry Shekhs, weekdays are a little tough for me. I have to be up early in the morning to be at work. My day usually starts at 5am. Hopefully this weekend. if you are playing.
Well well well, seems to me that at least a couple of matches were fixed this past weekend. Muslim Gym versus Rogers Park is an obvious giveaway due to shady characters on both sides. I am not entirely sure about United, mainly because the Chargers are pathetic. It's bad karma for both RP and MGCC, both teams will be "one and done" in the playoffs. Again, not sure about UCC because Chargers have stooped below all levels of mediocrity.
Guys, in keeping with the NRR calculation rules (MCC/ICC), I have checked all scorecards for Rogers Park, United and Pak Gym (teams tied on 32 points) and calculated the NRR as follows:
Pak: +0.607
United: +0.601
RP: +0.420
This was done using 40 overs for RP's 379 total and 2.1 for United's chase of 40. If we use 27 overs for RP's declared Inns and 3.1 overs for United then the numbers are:
RP: 0.570
United: 0.591
I have sent a copy of this sheet to the management and also to the editors of the blog so they can post it on here for your review etc.
Raheel
does it mean PG is thru to the playoffs?
-------
Pak v Muslim is presumably set for tomorrow night.
-------
Is it really? I had been under the impression that all semis were actually next week (and the "current week schedule" on the MCC page doesnt give much - it doesnt even list playoffs for day games for this weekend, and the only night game it lists this week is the one tonight between Challengers and Flames).
If it is certain that Pak and Muslim are playing tomorrow night, please let us know for sure on here ASAP :-) Plans for the evening will need to be reworked, to ensure presense at the Mother of All Battles :-)
c8w
Sadiq bhai, as of this afternoon the match has been moved to next week, so you may plan in advance! What is your email, you may review the excel sheet too and comment.
Ram, yes it would appear so, however I'm waiting for the management's take on it after they review the numbers, I don't wanna jump the gun right now.
Raheel,
Just let me know how did PG's NRR change from 0.49 to 0.607 in 1 game. I am assuming that previous scores entered by PG were all correct. Thanks.
Mehul
UCC
-----------
This weekend when the match was called off, the light was much better as compared to MUCC vs Wildcats game last year. It's upto you to trust me or not.
You have umpired so many games in Milwaukee. You know the normal time the game gets over. At 5:35 pm all this started.
Does all look fair to you ?
Bhavneet
MUCC
------
Bunty, I do trust you - Id probably trust you with my life, actually :-)
And I have umpired in Milwaukee a lot - had to do it too often, actually. As I said, I umpired at the same ground exactly 7 days before your game... and we played till 7:15 without either team mentioning the light. I remember the Wildcat game last year (I umpired that one too!).. it was cloudy all day, and we played all day with neither team raising any objection, of course. Which is why not many things about the end of the game look particularly fair to me at least (especially the pictures, which look quite bright).
All Iam saying is... as an umpire I find it hard to hear allegations of an umpire being paid off, or biased etc (and wanted to let Tango know that, in this one case at least, Owen was actually *not* travelling back with the visiting team either).
And Iam not saying PakGym is blameless here - they arent, IMHO they havent been blameless in any of the incidents over the past 3 weeks. But I dont believe the blame is all on them for this latest game, or even that a majority of the blame is on them... teams appeal for all sorts of things, that might make them unsporting. But the *decision* is not their fault, thats the umpires call. Similarly, I personally think the "reschedule" was totally wrong, and have said so on here before - some have agreed with me, others have totally disagreed with my opinion. With the "reschedule" too, PakGym is hardly blameless, they wanted it, they asked for it, they pushed for it... but the *decision* in the end was not made by them, thats all. (The third incident, the fight... ok, there is no "management" or "umpire" to shift the blame onto for that one, that one's all on them :-)
If what happened this weekend was wrong, then a large part of the blame does fall on the umpire, obviously (even as an umpire I cant wriggle out of that one :-) But I still find it hard to hear "bias", "bought" etc... it could have just been a mistake, we all make them. It could be different standards. My own standards, people have told me, are draconianly harsh - they feel that I make people play on when its too dark, too cloudy, too rainy etc (the Capitol folk, who I get along with very well and have a lot of respect for, very much feel that way after their game with you guys - they felt conditions were too difficult to play in, but I didnt think so, it was a hard call but it was my job to go with what I felt, and I did). I dont call off games easily - if it rains in the middle of the day, I'll often wait for an hour or two before calling anything off, even. Not everyone is like that, some umpires have different standards on what constitutes playable conditions. I realize it may sound like Iam making an excuse for a fellow umpire... maybe Iam. But I still say error in judgement or mistakes or different standards are more likely explanations than bias or corruption. Thats all.
c8w
Mehul, I am assuming the system does not count the overs properly in cases where teams are bowled out without batting out the full quota of overs. So to start with the 0.49 wasn't correct.
Hmm..I am not too sure about that. I thought as soon as you enter "all out" it takes in 40/45 overs to calculate. Also, if that is the case are you suggesting that NRR of all the teams might not be correct? If that is not true, then there is no way it can screw up only one team. The only way it can happen is if the scores are not entered in correctly in the first place. Correct me if I am wrong.
I don't know how the system works, I merely took the scores from the scorecards on the website and calculated NRR per ICC rules.
Only thing I can say is you are opening a whole new can of worms. Good luck with Championship!!
As per me, the NRR formulae used by MWCC is the same as ICC ...
I can vouch for that as my team was in playoffs contention in 2005 .. and had done all the possible calculations and found no differences ... with what was showing on MCC website and the NRR calculation formulae available on ICC website ...
Mehul, I reviewed it and you are right, I have made a mistake with one of the scores. Our NRR turns out to be 0.409 (which still doesn't match the website one), but it would still leave us short of RP by a fraction. Sorry everyone!
That'll teach me to multi-task with this crap while at work ..
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mehulshani said...
Only thing I can say is you are opening a whole new can of worms. Good luck with Championship!!
-------
It has all been seen before :-) Check out the points table for Division Two, 2005 regular season. That year 8 teams had 40 points or more... and the next 6 teams were all at 36 (ie 14 teams in all). So it was a run-rate battle.
Late in the season, teams discovered that their runrates were "wrong" - mistakes in inputting etc, basically I think things like opposition "130 allout in 25 overs" being listed as 25 overs rather than 40, and so on. There was an instance of a team in like 13th place working out what they had to win by, planning, executing it, and jumping to 12th... and then after that the former 12th team, *without playing a single game*, suddenly jumped to 10th because their runrate increased :-)
History, they say, first repeats itself as tragedy, and then as farce :-) (Alternately, what Division Two thinks today, Division One thinks tomorrow ;-)
I believe there was a movement after that crazy 2005 Div2 playoff situation to come up with a rule, that once you put in scorecards, you had a week or so to input them "properly" and/or correct them... and after that no changes could be made to NRRs etc. That, if you had input it wrongly and you true NRR was actually *lower*, it would be changed.. but if you were trying to increase your NRR late in the day saying "we made a mistake", it wouldnt be permitted. I dont know if that rule ever got into place or not (it should have, if it didnt).
That year, BTW, the final resolution was that an extra two "wildcard games" were added, and #10 thru #14 played each other in "play-in games" to reach the playoffs... IIRC, they played Saturday, and the winners played the actual playoff game on Sunday or some such. Maybe thats the solution. PakGym to play Rogers Park on Saturday in a play-in game, the winner to move onto the playoffs to take on St Louis on Sunday :-)
Seriously, this is all getting farcical, and is generally all quite crap. Last year Pak gave a walkover to enable Chargers to survive at the expense of Tigers, which sounded quite like a fixed game. This year Muslim shows up with 7 people against Rogers Park, to enable them to up their NRR and possibly eliminate Pak and/or United, which is surely another fixed game (at least by Muslim, if maybe not by RPCC). These things seriously need to be put an end to, once and for all.
I say in the offseason introduce a new rule - if any playoff team gives a walkover in the last 2-3 weeks, they are automatically out of the playoffs. If any team is found to have matchfixed and/or manipulated things (after investigation by the league, consultation with umpires and observers etc - showing up with 7/8 players is automatically considered matchfixing), the offending teams are out of the playoffs, plus penalties next year. If its one playoff team and one non-playoff team.. then both teams are out of playoffs obviously, but also next year the top rungetter and top wickettaker of each team is suspended for the first 3 games each. These things make a farce of our great game, and they must be fixed immediately, and the punishments should be draconian so that they never are even considered again.
Throw teams out of playoffs starting next year.. the teams due to play them get a walkover in the quarters (no, #9 and #10 dont get to benefit from this sort of thing - they were #9 and #10, they dont deserve to make the playoffs anyway :-) Eliminate this nonsense once and for all from our league.
c8w
wow...c8w...
I did not know u could write something like this. You used to be always "politically" correct. I guess these events ne tere zamir ko hila daala aur asli sadiq bahar kud kar aa gaya. Welcome home!!!
Sadiq,
For the first time I actually feel you are furious :)
Teams have to be penalized in such a way they pay for their mistakes.
Never mind the current NRR imbroglio (not suggesting it to dismiss it now), I do believe that the punishments meted out recently (with player suspensions) were very, very lenient - contrary to what you feel.
In order to prevent physical fights I think a one-year ban should be automatic. Imagine if one-season+ ban had been imposed on some players...that would have affected the teams this year and also next year. Nothing else would prevent the repeat of such fights.
Sadiq -
I do not appreciate consistently calling our game with Muslim a fixed game. You umpired the United/Chargers game, the outcome of which is pretty extreme too, but nobody from our team has made any accusations. You were not at our game, how do you know what happened?
The fact is that Muslim played with 7 players and put us at an extreme advantage but that is not our fault. It is not match fixing!! Just like every other game, there was a league official at our game too. You have been taking advantage of the fact that no one from our team has responded to your comments. If you can prove any wrong doing, then speak, otherwise be neutral like you often claim to be.
---------------------------
Reading earlier blogs, Raheel's RR calculations don't seem to add up for me. Maybe I'm doing something wrong. I guess we will soon find out. Either way, good luck to all.
--Asmar
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Asmar said...
Sadiq -
I do not appreciate consistently calling our game with Muslim a fixed game. You umpired the United/Chargers game, the outcome of which is pretty extreme too, but nobody from our team has made any accusations. You were not at our game, how do you know what happened?
The fact is that Muslim played with 7 players and put us at an extreme advantage but that is not our fault. It is not match fixing!! Just like every other game, there was a league official at our game too. You have been taking advantage of the fact that no one from our team has responded to your comments. If you can prove any wrong doing, then speak, otherwise be neutral like you often claim to be.
---------------------------
Asmar -in fact, if you read what I wrote carefully, you'll see I specifically absolved Rogers Park from blame. And, in real-life at least, Ive made this point to several people the last couple of days (at Hanover on Sunday and Monday, one umpiring and one watching part of the nightgame, where I got to talk to a fair few people)... that it isnt really Rogers Park's fault if their opposition shows up with 7 people, supposedly most of them non-regulars. If someone shows up without fielders and gives you easy bowling, what are you supposed to do, not hit it? Rogers Park hit it, and hit it very well - they cant be blamed for it in any way.
However, the idea that a team is showing up with 7 people and irregular ones at that.. surely thats a problem to start with? Muslim just used the rules as they currently are to the fullest - youre allowed to take the field with a minimum of 7 people, and nobody can control if youre playing regulars or not. Thus, we need to change the rules for next year IMHO - *something* must be done to avoid a team not trying to win, surely? (BTW, Iam presuming they werent trying to win based on the fact that they supposedly played 7 people, and non-regulars at that, which appears pretty damning. The league, Iam sure, will just talk to Anwer Khan and find out - he's a good umpire who knows what he's doing, he should be able to tell them how the game was played. But just showing up with 7 people appears pretty iffy to me, as Iam sure it does to most).
And youre right, the only game I can really talk about properly is the United/Chargers game which I umpired (if I had seen just the scorecard, Id probably have thought it was a quite shady game too, as you said :-) But at least Chargers played 11 players, and it was almost their full-strength lineup. They just batted poorly, and United bowled very very well on the day from what I saw.
BTW, I also think we're never really going to have "proof" one way or the other - what sort of proof can there be? There is no video or audio recording of Chargers talking to Pak Gym last year, and convincing them to stay home for the last game of the season - there never will be. Similarly we can never know whats in the mind of a team that shows up with 7 players, or their internal discussions. But what Iam saying is, we *have* to find a way to fix this thing for next year - this cant be allowed to happen every year. Put caveats into the rules in advance - and go with the best view of the observers in charge. But this general manipulation of things has got to be stopped.
(BTW, a lot of leagues around the country know that NRR is considered something easily manipulatable. So they have rules set in advance... if its a two-way tie, it is decided by head-to-head result between the teams - for playoffs, for relegation, whatever. If its a 3-way-tie, then the team that has beaten both other teams head-to-head goes thru. Sometimes even a third-tiebreaker of "results against common opponents" if neccessary etc. They all keep NRR as the *last* tiebreaker, simply because it is the most manipulatable and least fair way. Our league should IMHO do the same - but first, of course, we need to go to three divisions (because at the moment Div2 teams dont play half the other teams so there are many times when head-to-head never comes into the picture). That should be the first and most obvious change IMHO - we ought to go to three divisions, and head-to-head as the first tiebreaker.If you couldnt beat your closest opponent on the field, you dont deserve to get in just because your run-rate was better - what happened on the field should be of greatest importance.
c8w
Guys here is the NRR formula:
={(total runs for team / total overs faced)- (total run against / total over bowled)}
So in english:
(1). Total runs scored by calculating team divided by total over faced by calculating team
(2). Total run given by calculating team divided by total over bowled by calculating team.
3. simply now 1 minus 2 above.
Hopefully that clearfies.....
Guys here are my final calculations:
Rogers Park:
After assuming St. louis game played for 40 overs, capitol played for 40 overs, united game played for 35 overs, and royals game played for 40 overs.
RP total score = 2027, overs faced 475.4 ...... 4.263
other teams scored = 2077, overs bowled 445.7 .... 4.660
Hence NRR for Rogers parks is: 0.3963
Now Pak Gym
All game played for 45 overs
Pak total score = 1406, overs faced 330.5 ..... 4.254
other teams scored = 1522, overs bowled = 326.1 .... 4.667
Hence NRR for Pak Gym is: 0.413
Difference between Pak and Rogers
Pak has + 0.0168
Congrats to Pak, you guys have made it to the playoffs....
Cricketwallah said...
Our league should IMHO do the same - but first, of course, we need to go to three divisions (because at the moment Div2 teams dont play half the other teams so there are many times when head-to-head never comes into the picture).
-----------------------------------
Had brought this up with Sridher recently in a casual conversation and the issue seems to be the # of grounds available for scheduling games.
Now in Div 2, we don't play about a dozen teams. If Div 2 is split into 2 and 3, then we need to add a dozen games, atleast per team in Div 3. The biggest stumbling block seems to be the availability of grounds.
I don't see Div 3 happening unless we get more grounds.
Blog Police can we have a new thread for Division 2 Playoff Talk. This blog is boring me with Pak Gymkhan's issue. 160 plus post and 99% on the same issue.
There is more happening in MCC in the coming week.
A. CCI vs IIT - IIT wins and wins it big. CCI's cinderella story ends here.
B. Evanston vs Advancers - Excellent game coming up. Both teams are in excellent form and well balanced. Evanston relies on pace more and Advancers is primarily spinners. I feel that Evanston wins this becaus they have Perrin.
C. Giants vs QC Kings - Giants played QC Kings few weeks back and that game ended in a draw Giants 219 in 40 for 7 Wickets / QC Kings 219 all out in 39.1 Overs. QC Kings is much improved team this year. I really like Pankag and his guys. Good people that want to play good cricket. I tell you this much, the winner of this game will play in the finals.
D. Jaguars vs Peoria - Jaguars can pull the rabbit out of the hat. I have seen these guys play and they play like a cohesive unit. Peoria is not different. My gut says Peoria will prevail.
Sadiq,
I love you man, but you really annoy me sometimes when you intentionally/unintentionally misinterpret my statements.
Let me make one thing clear: I am not accusing Owen Gray of anything.
The only thing I said about him was…
Do you really expect us to believe that the umpire, Gary Owen, is not intimidated by the fact that he has a two-hour trip back to Chicago with the same Junglee’s who started a fight last week?
You made two valid corrections from my above statement.
1. His name is not Gary Owen, its Owen Gray. Sure, fine, you know better. I mean, I don’t eat, sleep and shit Midwestcricket like you.
2. He didn’t travel with Pak Gymkhana. Fine, does it really make a difference? Pak Gymkhana has a history of starting fights in the middle of the ground. And most of the times, they’ve gotten away with it.
As you yourself pointed out, this team has been involved in numerous such incidents before. The only time they got penalized was last week (correct me if I’m wrong here), when they picked up a fight against Muslim Gymkhana, a team who’s equally close to the President as them. These guys should have been suspended the first times they started a fight, not the fourth TIME.
Don’t you think it’s possible that the umpire might have been intimidated by the Pak Gymkhana players for the various reasons cited above? I sure as hell would.
Now, obviously there are a few umpires, like you, who won’t get intimidated by such hoodlums. Maybe that’s why they don’t let you umpire Pak Gymkhana games anymore. Sadiq, when was the last time you umpired a Pak Gymkhana game?
Let us also keep in mind the two sources of all our information. One is the Milwaukee United team, who has never been involved in any altercation before, atleast to my knowledge. I don’t think there is more sincere and honest guy in this league than Bunty.
On the other hand we have Pak Gymkhana, who has a history of cheating, fighting, unsportsmanlike behavior. *Sorry Raheel, I'd really like to see things from your point of view, but I can't seem to get my head that far up my ass.*
The game was called off at 5:50PM, and as Bunty pointed out, Pak Gymkhana started crying at 5:35PM. How ridiculous is that? I don’t care how many clouds there are in the sky, you don’t call off a game at 5:50PM, especially when the other team is on the verge of an easy win.
When you put all these things together, I can quiet confidently point out the guilty party.
++++++++++The fact is that Muslim played with 7 players and put us at an extreme advantage but that is not our fault. It is not match fixing!! Just like every other game, there was a league official at our game too. You have been taking advantage of the fact that no one from our team has responded to your comments. If you can prove any wrong doing, then speak, otherwise be neutral like you often claim to be.
+++++++++++++++
Come on Asmar, the whole league knows what your team is capable of. Rogers Park can never score 379 runs even in 100 overs against any team, not even in 30/30.
Dont be mad at Sadiq for speaking the truth, the whole league is talking about what a shameful thing your team has done. Sadiq is the only one who said it loud.
I agree with Tonald...that incidents in last couple of weeks have taken away the joy out of playoff season this year.
I feel what ever mess we are in is our own creation so everybody in this league have to take blame.
There is no scorecard updates for last weeks DIV II playoffs and no schedule for this week..it is all a big mess.
Can we move on from here and discuss more about the upcoming games or start a separate thread?
if anyone need a prove that rogerspark/muslim game is fixed check farhat & shiraz phone bill for past 3 weeks and u will find out plus one of the rogerspark player is almost everyday on farhat's house.
is = was
may be there should be a poll? Which team should be banned, "team which asks umpire for bad light to come to playoffs" or "teacm which fixes a game to come into playoffs"
We should invest more time devicing rules so that teams don't take the League and teams for ride with stupid personal agendas Div-I suppose to the elite group, now make everyone think is it really? It appears for any blogger reading that elite of Div i are nothing but bunch of sore loosers who don't know how to play cricket right Looking at Div-II teams have so much respect for each other NOT in one case did any one set up anything like in Div-I
Like C8w said we need to invest more time devicing rules this offseason with scenarios that come up like these and team indulging in farcical games should be penalized with season bans, not just 2or 3 games every team should think twice before monkeying around with the spirit of the game
Guys, first of all sorry for all the confusion yesterday, apparently my formula was correct, but I reversed the scores of one match and hence the erraneous NRR of 0.6. I still don't know how the system counts the overs. For calculator savvy people on here if you want these are the #s from matches (all our matches were 45 overs):
Royals: 121 a.o. (45)
PG: 122 (25)
PG: 181 a.o. (45)
Capitol: 174 a.o. (45)
PG: 313 a.o. (45)
Flames: 193 a.o. (45)
Wildcats: 238 (45)
PG: 195 a.o. (45)
PG: 96 a.o. (45)
StL: 97 (15.5)
Purdue: 315 (45)
PG: 287 a.o. (45)
PG: 219 a.o. (45)
Bears: 78 a.o. (45)
MUCC: 190 (45)
PG: 109 (31.1)
PG runs scored: 1522, overs: 326.1
Runs conceded: 1406, overs: 330.5
1522/326.1 - 1406/330.5 = 0.413
I am with Sadiq bhai on this, it seems that NRR is easily manipulated based on scorecards and how the overs are counted in the system. Head to head record should first be used for teams tied on points.
Food for Thought:
United is the second worst team in conceding runs in the top 13 teams in the league this year with Mehul in the line up for 80% of the games
Chargers has put up the 4th highest runs in all teams in this league at 2256, only behind batting giants like, Purdue, Challengers and Wildcats
Pak Gymkhana has the most rain out games and complained about not being able to play cricket and it is not fair but requesting to call off a game due to bad light that would be completed in all fairness. Each time PG is in trouble they have resolved to Rain and 20 overs whenever they can like the Phoenix game MG game last year in the QF where the ground was not quite playable and they insisited on continuing because they were well placed. Umpire allowed it (perhaps he was scared, rightly so to)
Rogers Park top score for the season has been 250 in 45 overs
AAA did not give a single Walkover all season long except for the last 2 games of the season, both of which if the had won, there was a possibility of avoiding relegation.
No Division 1 game has been called off due to Bad Light in at least the last 5 years of MCC (or maybe more), except for the final 2 years ago. Also where PG was involved and it was a 50 over game on Oct 16th 1 month from last Sunday, what an irony.
MG lowest total with all 11 players playing in a 45 over game is against St. Louis with Kamran, Imran and Rizwan in the lineup, at 149.
i am with c8w ( throw the teams out of the playoff ) but why wait next year put the investigation team and do it this year and if they find them guilty give the chance to next two teams which is phoenix & royals. But as we all know that mr.T.A. don't have guts do that.Because all 3 teams in the cotroversy is good friends with T.A. and the Admisntration.
Sadiq Sir,
All the umpires are asked to fax a copy of score-sheet to MCC after the match ... Does not MCC check the score-sheet and the scores entered on the site to see that they are in sync ..
Here is Rogers Park NRR calculation based on exact scorecards -
vs MUCC - FOR(120/24), Against(119/45)
vs StLouis - FOR(135/40), Against(136/26.3)
vs AAA - FOR(72/15), Against(70/45)
vs Purdue - FOR(181/45), Against(352/45)
vs MCC - FOR(141/40), Against(142/23)
vs Capitol - FOR(197/36.2), Against(195/40)
vs Flames - FOR(249/45), Against(204/45)
vs Chargers - FOR(182/31), Against(181/45)
vs Pheonix - FOR(97/40), Against(180/40)
vs United - FOR(159/35), Against(132/35)
vs Royals - FOR(165/40), Against(262/40)
vs Muslim - FOR(379/40), Against(54/40)
Totals - FOR(2077/431.2), Against(2027/469.3)
When you subtract the two, RR comes out to +0.4975
Asmar, from the website scorecards,
RP v AAA is listed as 40 over game, not 45: http://www.midwestcricket.org/asp/Score88.asp?id=2568
RP v Milwaukee CC 142 scored by Milw in 19.2 overs not 23: http://www.midwestcricket.org/asp/Score88.asp?id=2634
Take the scores directly from the scorecard, don't recalculate the overs. If you make those changes you will see that your NRR is 0.414.
Now, 0.413 v 0.414 - do you wanna flip a coin ? :p
Sorry, 19.1 not 19.2. I did the same for us by the way ... took all the scores directly from scorecards and didn't recalculate overs. So, what do you people think:
- Should Rogers park go ahead by a difference of less than 0.1%
- A pre quarter final to decide the #8 position
- Toss
Raheel,
The AAA game was a 45 over game. They were all out and possibly marked it their scorecard as 40. Even if we leave that as is, the MCC game was definitely 23 overs.
Add the number of overs bowled by all our bowlers and its 23. If the system does not calculate it that way, then that is definitely a mistake on MCC's part that needs to be fixed. I was under the impression that overs are counted using the opponents bowling stats.
If not, then you are right, let's just flip a coin )
Asmar and Raheel
I guess Raheel is right about the AAA game being 40 overs and not 45. As for the MCC VS RPCC game, MCC's batting card says 19.2 while RPCC's bowling sheet says 23 overs.
Also, i assume both of you are not converting the partially completed overs to the correct fraction. For example say 469.1 overs, meaning 469 overs + 1 ball will be 469+(1/6) for NRR calculations.
Taking into account this info..
PG NRR : 0.416451954
RPCC NRR (AAA game 40 ovs, MCC game 19.2 overs) : 0.416748046
RPCC NRR (AAA game 40 ovs, MCC game 23 overs): 0.451469314
I have not cross checked any of the data Asmar/Raheel posted. I cross checked Raheel's post with regs to RPCC matches and I am assuming Asmar will cross check all of Raheel's posts!!!
raheel rogerspark will never play a pre-quater final with you guys because they know they can only make the playoff by fixing games with other teams.
chal hat, I thought about that but wasn't sure if the Midwest system adjusted that, but good point - however as you can see the relative #s still stay the same: 0.416 v 0.417.
Asmar, I don't know the correct # of overs, but its recorded in the system as 19.1 and thats what we have to go by for now.
I hope this whole situation gets resolved ASAP one way or the other, I'm startin to get a headache!
did anyone saw yuvraj six sixes on six balls against stuart broad it was aweeeeeesomeeeeeeee.......chak de india..
Carnage.....absolute carnage @ Kingsmead....
I'm a witness..!
Yuvraj rocks!!!!
50 off 12 balls....
And 36 off of Stuart Board's over...
What happened to the night game yesterday?
Challengers beat Flames by 4 wickets!!
Flames 110 in 20
Sanjay 3 wickets
Challengers 111 in 15.
Mahesh 51 n.o, Bhavesh 28
Correction..
Challengers beat Flames by 6 wickets!!
does anyone the link where we can watch 20T live or highlights? Thanks.
Shekhs,
Congrats on the win. Good luck to everyone in the playoffs. I'll be there to watch Challengers game this weekend.
Samir,
Check
www.crickethighlights.info
Install firefox..
Cheers
Madhu M
Thanks Madhu.
Samir
Thanks Samir!
See you this weekend..
Game highlights of ICC20/20 can be seen at www.worldtwenty20.com, this requires no downloads and of course this is not live but closest to live for free.
p l a y - b a l l
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ice_cold said...
Come on Asmar, the whole league knows what your team is capable of. Rogers Park can never score 379 runs even in 100 overs against any team, not even in 30/30.
Dont be mad at Sadiq for speaking the truth, the whole league is talking about what a shameful thing your team has done. Sadiq is the only one who said it loud.
-------
Once again I'd like to clarify - this is exactly what I have *not* said (out loud, or softly :-)
I have plenty of respect for Rogers Park's batting - Ive seen Moti bat for several years, Kami is a terrific clean striker at the top of the order, Nasir is consistently good (Top 15 batting the past couple years IIRC), Mohd Al is a great pickup who improves the batting significantly too. What RPCC is, is its an aggressive team - Shiraz, Zeeshan etc, all go after the bowling a fair bit. They can sometimes get out early, but they can also tear an attack apart when theyre "on".
I have umpired games before when teams play with 10 men - its hard. And games with 9 fielders - there are yawning gaps in the field with even 9 fielders. With only 7 men playing... keeper, bowler, 3 men on offside, 2 men on legside...bowl to Kamran and Shiraz with that sort of field, there could be major-league carnage. If that same game is played again with only 7 men, there is likely to be a *huge* score posted by RPCC again - maybe 380, maybe not, but pretty damn huge probably. This is exactly why Ive said before, that I *dont* think this is RPCC's fault - someone shows up with no fielders and bowls pies at you, what are you supposed to do, not hit it?
The problem lies when a team shows up with only 7 guys in an important game, and that too supposedly non-regulars and kids. But, of course, by the letter of the law they didnt violate anything - youre allowed to play "new players" in regular season (just not in playoffs), and 7 in the minimum number you have to show up with to avoid a walkover. All the violated was the spirit of the game - violated it completely and totally.This is why the laws have to be changed, or caveats put in, by our league at the end of the season IMHO. We have to find a way to eliminate this stuff.
c8w
Someone must be in the zone that day to score 379. This calls for an immediate human harmone growth testing in MWCC prior to playoff. just kidding. Anything is possible in life, sir, so relax and if they scored 379 this shows this league has lot of mediocre team even in the so called league A.
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